Gunslingers, along with the other extended classes, are meant to overachieve ONLY the first classes.
So gunslingers should be able to defeat an archer, and hold up it's own against a sniper/hunter decently.
Taekwon can probably takedown a swordsman + merchant and be able to fight fairly against a a knight/crusader/blacksmith.
Ninja can kill a thief or mage easily, and fight against an assassin/rogue or a wizard/sage.
Extended classes were never meant to be as good as the originals.
So keep that in mind.
The only way to reduce FA damage is to be resistant to Neutral attacks (ala Ghostring, Raydric, Harpy, etc.), and those typically aren't in the hands of every player.
but on my server, recently, i noticed Ninja to be strongly overpowering. With no delays to their cast, they are almost owning every class. It seems, their skills are much more rounded than the skills of a mage class.Same applies to the server that I play on. Several people complain about Ninjas
Well its mostly because Eathena is emulating the bug on kro/iro where freezeing spear is doing 100% matk instead of 70% like its supposed to. Add in the fact that lvl 1 fs casts very fast and hits 3 times.. 300%matk for low sp and very spamable. Cicada can be used against a ninja that relys on it too much.. Bushin is alot better althought cicada has its place as well. Flip tatami turns your square into penuma for 3 seconds(no ranged damage) but has a 3 second delay... basicly meaning it can slow down the pace of a ranged battle for you but youd have to hide as soon as its turns off and jump away(or possibly shadow slash if youre mele) otherwise it just prolongs the inevidable. A good ninja can beat a sniper at times though.. just gotta outsmart him.It doesnt matter if Freezing Spear does 100% instead of 70%,
HE S IN HR AND IN HR ALL OF THE NON SINX/CHAMP CLASSES SUCK
if you knew how to play a gunslinger you wouldnt say they suck. jesus just get a butcher or destoryer then use gatling fever and you can be attacking at the fastest possible speed (depending on gears & server aspd cap)
splash damage skill and a shotty can own large areas of monsters/people and spamming bullet shower with lots of dex and luk can own aswell.
Vet Person (GS) > non vet other class.
No single class sucks. It depends on how well you play them (and that statement includes what gears you hunt for your char, your build, your strategies, everything). It is entirely dependent on YOU to make your char worth playing.
No single class sucks. It depends on how well you play them (and that statement includes what gears you hunt for your char, your build, your strategies, everything). It is entirely dependent on YOU to make your char worth playing.
completely bullcrap statement when considering the HP/SP modifiers on GS as well as their lack of a shield based item and the amount of range resistance based items in the game makes them competitivly null on most servers.
Horn card = 35%
2x Alligator card = 10%
Yellow Bandana = 10%
Long Mace = 10% if aco class
Noxious card = 10%range/10%neutral
65/75% total ranged resist, not including w/e custom crap you have on your servers giving more ranged resistance. Any decent player would also be able to swap thara and horn using BM.
I'd have to say that GS just don't cut it unless seriously amped up to meet sniper standards.
never, never say a specific job sucks because some elitists with 10 years RO experience will always try to proof how good it is and how suck you are.
Gawd, you guys just don't want to acknowledge it, eh? GSes ARE subpar.
If a skilled player uses a novice, he can probably kill a noob with a trans class too. That does not mean that novices aren't subpar, is meant for PvP, is great at killing and surviving.
Desperado 50k damage, and Full Buster killing spree my foot. Really. Either your opponents have a negative IQ or they are really, really undergeared. Like wearing Tuxedo to WoE. Okay, I'm exaggerating, but still.
And can you guys stop with the "No class sucks, it's up to you to play it well"? It doesn't make you look any more intelligent, clever, whatever. GS is subpar, it's the truth, in a purely -trans classes outclasses it in all areas- sense. Someone might kill trans classes with a GS, but does that mean it isn't subpar? NO! It just means that the player is skilled. A 110% effort from the player, while being fully disadvantaged using a subpar class.
Zyaber is right. Completely bullcrap indeed. And even if you guys have epic gear, you do understand that heaping those gear on a trans class is much, much more wise and effective?
Desperado 50k damage, and Full Buster killing spree my foot. Really. Either your opponents have a negative IQ or they are really, really undergeared. Like wearing Tuxedo to WoE. Okay, I'm exaggerating, but still.You missed two little words in my post. They said 'without reduction'. Since WoE isn't everything and some people actually do PvM at level 99/70, not to mention that not every class has access to all reduction gear, I always refer to unmodified damage. I personally never do WoE because my CPU does not live through it without seizures of epic proportions.
Not saying that you are, you actually seem to be quite reasonable despite the tone of your writing.
Just for all those saying OMG GS SUX. It's not the class but the player that matters. Any class is playable if the player is good enough.
What I'm trying to argue is that skills, stats and concept-wise, the class is just fundamentally flawed.
Just for all those saying OMG GS SUX. It's not the class but the player that matters. Any class is playable if the player is good enough.
and what we're saying is that if two players of equal skill play a GS vs Name any other class, more than half the other classes will kill the GS.
Like I said earlier, I like the GS class, it has some useful skills, Fling being one of them, especially during MVPing, also Disarm is debilitating, taking some classes out of the fight altogether from a safe range if they don't have FCP on. They also have some half decent DPS.
What I'm trying to argue is that skills, stats and concept-wise, the class is just fundamentally flawed.
@cookie: i was having a bad day, hence the tone. Sorry if i offended anyone.You are forgiven. Have a cookie.
Or, for example...gatling GS, with breeze card in his gatling? Bleeding for everyone...bullseye skill can be used to try coma on very tough opponents, etc...anything is possible, you just have to find the way.
Wanna bet AB can deal 10k, or at least close to it? Get a max INT Creator and see for yourself. With a GS's lousy HP modifier and inability to wear Valk Armor for stun resistance, either he gets low VIT, dies while stun-locked due to pure Dazzler Gypsies, or die to 1-2 AB with high VIT.
Again, FCP is mandatory in WoE. And do not underestimate the ability of pros to single you out even if you're stacked in a mob.
I still can't understand how you think GS'es can deal decent burst damage. Never seen one which could. Have you even taken into account the DEF, and reduction gears that WoE characters should have? BTW, you're spewing rubbish when you say that it has the potential to outdamage an EDP SB. Not all SinX'es have rubbish gears. Wait. WOW. You just said Desperado, didn't you? Good job comparing an AoE to a single-target skill.
Are we even discussing WoE on the same setting? Is this about 50-player-or-more guilds pitting themselves against each other, with proper job composition, resource spamming, individuals with more than 50 DEF on average? Where Creators do not scrimp on ABs and spam them whenever they can, and use their Vanils only when about to bomb enemies? Where SinXs EDP every minute, Champions spam Royal Jellies and use Berries, and there are pure Slim Pitching Creators spamming Slim Pitch on the guild during every encounter with the enemy? Where Profs spam Web, Dispel and Land Prot, Paladins spam Devotion, Clowns and Gypsies refresh songs every other moment?
Yes. Why you wasted your time writing all of that is beyond me =p. Your whole argument basically revolved around the usefulness of a Gunslinger compared to a Sniper's. It was my intention to make it clear that both classes while both being ranged, shined in very different situations. Are you going to tell people not to make ninjas because high wizards are much better, even though you know fully well they don't even work the same way? Because that's exactly what you've been doing here.
You're not going to be using a Cranial all of the time. It is definite there will be times where you are caught w/o a Cranial. Like while you're FB-ing and someone ADs you. Even if it does 7k, note that I said 1-2 ABs.
Why stun immune? I prefer not to include MVP cards, thank you very much. If so, you might as well be saying that a GS will be effective, ONLY if one has an Orc Hero card. And if you're on official, you'll find your guild leader screaming at you to pass it to classes which will benefit from it much, much more, such as Champs/ Creators/ SinXs/ Professors.
BTW, no, it isn't wishful thinking, my guild does indeed FCP everyone as a b4-battle prep. However, it is rare, and not right to expect it of everyone, I'll admit that.
[email protected] the potential. Nah, that wouldn't be really what I call potential. I prefer to take countless variables into account before stating whether something has 'potential'.
If you read through my previous posts, you'll see that I concede that GS'es play a different role as compared to other trans classes. I have debunked arguments involving both and pointed out that they serve very different purposes. However, you can actually weigh what the classes offer. In a Sniper VS GS situation, I would rather pick the Sniper because of what one has to offer, even if they are different. Purely because the GS does not shine well in what it does. If I wanted ranged DPS, I will not pick the GS, period. In fact, I will only pick AB Creators, SBK SinXs and Sharpshooting Snipers. If I wanted Desperado-type DPS, I rather pick MA SinXs, because of what else it has to offer.
It is, in short, too limited, and nowhere near the best at what it does. In WoE.
magnum break (probably custom since it's supposed to apply to just swordies)
It's literally a gimmick class imo.
So you're not going to endow FB then? Good luck trying to even put a dent on anyone, lol. Of course I know how to switch, but when you're up against people that you're afraid of endowing after switching due to that small delay...yeah.
Hmm. Oh well. It's pretty hard to survive with 97 Vit as any other trans class (except for LK/Palas), much less a GS.
MA can be pretty good under Strings, with its effect, and with an Ice Pick/Imma Sword. About the rest, lol. Kinda depends on your server's rates :/
Snipers are an underrated class. They can rape sinx with a ds+flee build in a lowrate. In highrates, i've seen snipers with tg cards that could pwn sinxs cuz the magnum break (probably custom since it's supposed to apply to just swordies) knocks them away and they can deal mean damage against sinx with a couple dses and their hp rate isn't bad. They're needed for woe. They are also extremely versatile in builds.
Gunslingers......great god. Their hp rate is just horrible. It's literally a gimmick class imo. They can't compete that well with the other classes since they're only limited to one pvp build- handguns. Even in their vit build, they're quite shoddy. Many gunslingers equips suggest agi builds but it just doesn't work and giving gunslingers a metaling/whitesmith card is inferior compared to giving a sniper/sinx those cards.