Started by Kushiro, Jan 12, 2023, 01:38 AM
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Quote from: kaitosyn on Jan 12, 2023, 09:46 AMI wanted to back you up, really. But the moment I read "you don't have the right to monetize this game", I feel like your logic doesn't make any sense. Yes, they don't have the right to monetize from other people property because it's >>>ILLEGAL<<<....but, don't you know playing in a private server even for 1 min or 1 sec, or even you downloaded the installer or join the server's community is also >>>ILLEGAL<<< ?Basically you are the same as that server too.If you think that server is s***, doesn't that means you are also a s*** too? Because I think both of the server and you doing the same thing that illegal, so....The more civilized way to response your rant, do you know that opening a Private Server required some money to maintain (electricity bills, food etc) and I assume that server is also paying for the monthly fee VPS or if they have several GMs, I'm pretty sure they don't work for free also.So, if they don't monetize this server, would you be kind enough to tell or teach us with your ungodly knowledge how to maintain the server without money?
Quote from: Nova on Jan 12, 2023, 09:24 AMAs for your point, idk if I would call that P2W as the costumes are purely cosmetic, right? It's more like...Hmmm...Pay2Skip maybe? Someone else can come up with a better name for it. But here's the thing, if you make cosmetic items account-bound, you're gonna get people who will complain about that. I can imagine some BR dude be like; "why u make this untradeable don't u know our brazilian pezos (or w/e coins they use) are only worth 1/100 of a dollar is too expensive wtf!!" or something along those lines. No offence btw, this could easily be someone from the PPNS as well, just giving an example. If you sell Flapping Angel Wings for $100 and someone like me buys it, no matter how hard they worked ingame, others wouldn't be able to get it and that's not cool either(for them). Having said that, I am in favour of untradeable cosmetic items if it helps with server costs and staff motivation. And if people complain about it, look the world isn't fair, suck it up.
Quote from: Nova on Jan 12, 2023, 11:41 AMBuddy chill, I'm just saying. I play on a non-donation server maybe you should join us there. Or did you actually start playing there without knowing they sell tradeable costumes?
Quote from: Nova on Jan 12, 2023, 11:51 AMPayon Stories. They have legit 500 players online with only single client allowed. 1x without donations.
Quote from: Kushiro on Jan 12, 2023, 11:18 AMFalse equivalency, it's not the same to play on a pirate server than to actually make the server and even benefit economically from private property, is not remotely on the same level, never in history a company has sued anyone for playing on a pirate server they sue the ones providing the pirate service and more so if they are gaining an economical benefit from it.
Quote from: kaitosyn on Jan 12, 2023, 12:27 PMIt really just a simple way to think....You use money from a robber that just rob a bank with the knowledge about where that money coming from, the cops won't arrest you? Even your existence (including all of us) right now in this forum can be counted as illegal. The moment we make an account in here or private server while we also know and understand that this forum right now provide PS info and the server you join provide illegal service is already make us a criminal and make us in the same shoes as those private server owner, while the difference is we enjoy illegal service and the PS owner enjoy our donation money. So what you wrote about "They don't have the right to monetize blablabla" kinda HYPOCRITE, don't you think?With the way you think about stuff, for some reason I can feel like you still a youngster with short fuse. I hope I am wrong because this game is kinda old, and is kinda rare to see youngster nowadays play it.
Quote from: Kushiro on Jan 12, 2023, 01:38 AMso if you liked OriginsRO but detested the politically correct, passive agressive cowards that plagued that server, deranged leftists, well too bad because they are there, and they are still the same hypocrite scumbags that unless you are part of their sect they immediately jump all over you making fake accusations and passive agressive attacks to then call an administrator to ban you, you have to play by their rules type of sectarians
Quote from: Xaenor on Jan 12, 2023, 01:59 PMFirst of all, you are out of your goddamn mind. If someone in the main chat/Discord threatens violence, behaves like a bigot or suggests somebody else to harm themselves, they get rightfully muted or banned. That's not being deranged - that's normal.
QuoteSecond, I've been playing Alfheim for a bit over a year now. Costumes are rewards for donations - and there are many people who donate, because a lot of them genuinely enjoy playing. I am not one of them, but I see the appeal of paying $5 a month to reward Charlie for his work and allow to pay for Ken's efforts.
QuoteThat being said, good bloody luck selling any of the costumes you receive for donations - like I said, there are many supporters; they receive costumes every month; GMs often (multiple times a week) conduct server-wide events that award free costumes; sometimes, if you are lucky, you can even get a free costume as a gift or find one in one of the hidden treasure boxes around the world.What I'm saying is that the server is saturated with costumes to the point that funding your character through selling them is, at best, a challenging endeavour. It has always been that way - even in the early months, people had a lot of trouble off-loading the costumes on the market, because they are just cosmetics and there is not a lot of demand for them.
QuoteIf you actually tried to play and gave us data on how well the costumes sell, I could see your argument as being more valid. As of now, you simply sound upset over a (deserved) Discord ban where you spammed Olympic gifs in response to any counter-arguments from other players.
Quote from: Kushiro on Jan 12, 2023, 11:55 AMIsn't that OathRo? the one that just destroyed all the people data and expects them to relevel from zero all over again?, I'm sorry but I don't trust my time to a server that has a history of just killing people time investment like that, besides its x1 server, not playing x1 server again period and precisely because all the x1 servers that have existed all have wasted the people time investment, all have closed or done crap s***, no thanks my time is valuable and a resource I can't get back.
Quote from: iixe on Jan 12, 2023, 09:37 PMI think that OP f*** is more mad then I am. And that means something.Charlie created an enviroment that I've never seen before. A Fabre card costs more then a Diabolous Robe, which is usally barely affordable. Price points are shifted in way that basic gear can be collected within a few hours if you start with a 1/1 novice and have space to improve even after months of farming the same thing.Also, p2w per definition describes a business model that forces you purchse a pool of items that are either unaccessible via f2p or having an item spiral that requires a progression rate that is very hard or sheer impossible to maintain without money. Mobile games often use this. The definition finds acceptance in most mmo comunities. Would be good to know what p2w means. Would make you look less stupid.Ive seen alot of dumb things over the years but this thread is remarkable.
Quote from: Sairek Ceareste on Jan 12, 2023, 11:41 PMIsn't the definition of "p2w" described as an aspect of the game allows players to purchase in-game items to gain an advantage?Because by the definition you provided, something like Diablo Immortal wouldn't be qualified as pay to win, despite the fact that if I swiped my credit card a few times, and you didn't, it would take you potentially decades (no exaggeration) to catch up to me and I would be stronger than you the entire time. Keep in mind that the game also has competitive PvP, so it's not just paying to dominate PvE.There's also the problem that Diablo Immortal shames its F2P players, but that's another issue entirely.
Quote from: Sairek Ceareste on Jan 12, 2023, 11:41 PMI'd rather myself and the rest of OathRO staff not be associated with the actions of a single individual to which we had no say in."We" didn't do anything and were as much victims as the players were. "Oathkeeper" is the one who destroyed players' data.The only thing the rest of OathRO staff are guilty of is trying to fix what damage Oathkeeper has done and making sure he doesn't get what he wanted. We don't expect everyone to restart, nor do they have to. We however have worked, and are continuing to work diligently that the option for people is there (which we are under no obligation to have to do, mind you). Having an option for people to choose from is better than no option at all in my opinion. It's the best we can do given the circumstances we were dealt.Oathkeeper, who destroyed everyone's data and undermined all of staff's free labour is gone and is not a part of Payon Stories.Isn't the definition of "p2w" described as an aspect of the game allows players to purchase in-game items to gain an advantage?Because by the definition you provided, something like Diablo Immortal wouldn't be qualified as pay to win, despite the fact that if I swiped my credit card a few times, and you didn't, it would take you potentially decades (no exaggeration) to catch up to me and I would be stronger than you the entire time. Keep in mind that the game also has competitive PvP, so it's not just paying to dominate PvE.There's also the problem that Diablo Immortal shames its F2P players, but that's another issue entirely.In a game like Ragnarok Online, the ability to just add millions of total networth to your account instead of having to farm for it with just a few swipes of your credit card seems like an incredibly powerful ability in my eyes that not everyone has access to, but that's just my two cents.Regardless, servers do need to pay their bills. I think OP would have done better just making a factual review and trying to put biases aside. Then people can just make the informed decision if they do or don't want to play there. Harping on this specific issue so aggressively just makes everything come off as disingenuous, even if it is true.
Quote from: yC on Jan 13, 2023, 05:09 AMKushiro, you talk big but you are hiding under a disposable email address. We do not allow users to hide under (potentially) different identity for obvious reasons. It also means you reject all contact from our forum, then why you expect us to share your review with the communities?Since you have an opinion to share, why don't you update your email address on the account to resolve that? I'll give that 24 hours and if nothing is done I'll have no choice but to junk this topic. You can use the forum function to update your email address on profile.* This message is not delivered in pm for the reason that if the topic goes to the junk yard later, here is the reason *
Quote from: Nova on Jan 13, 2023, 01:09 PMYou need to chill out. Other than decorating their server like a wedding cake, they haven't done anything wrong. You should have been here when Lord J was still around, then you would have seen how far people can really take it. Unless...
Quote from: PriestsDontHeal on Jan 13, 2023, 01:10 PMYou have a lot of valid points that I'm pretty sure that if they were communicated by a different person could be taken seriously by a reasonable admin and considered to improve the server. But it is pretty clear that you are an insufferable human being and I understand why you were shunned by the community, I don't play Alfheim but ... good riddance everyone, I am honestly hoping that you don't end up in the server where I play.You strike me as the guy that took a Logic 101 class ten years ago and thinks he is Mario Bunge ever since, a perfect depiction of the Dunning-Kruger bias.
Quote from: Kushiro on Jan 13, 2023, 02:26 PMI have valid points but you dislike I am using logic and reason? well you to me sound like one of those people that actually dislike logic and reason because they are perpetually offended by everything.
Quote from: PriestsDontHeal on Jan 13, 2023, 05:05 PMI am all for logic and reason, I dedicated my whole adult life to studying it, and I literally both teach it and apply it for a living. I dislike the fact that you emptily throw the words "logic and reason" around just to think you are smarter than everyone when in reality your post was 20% valid points, 80% fallacies and cognitive biases, and 100% you being an obnoxious a******. Like I said, you are a perfect example of a Dunning-Kruger bias and as long as you don't learn how to better communicate with other human beings you will keep getting shunned by every community regardless of how smart you think you are (you are not). Anyone can take an "Introduction to Logic" class and start yelling the name of various fallacies onto people's faces, that doesn't make you a Logician or a Philosopher. People that actually know how to apply logic in their argumentation are usually able to pinpoint the biases in their own rethoric as well, not just in others', but you need something called intelectual honesty for that.It is very clear that your opinions and the way you communicate them were not welcome neither in Alfheim nor here in this forum. Alfheim is a private server and they are welcome to do whatever the hell they want with it, you can't do anything about it. So why don't you "apply logic and reason" and move on now? I'm sure there's plenty of other servers that could use your brilliant "gigachad philosopher" input.
Quote from: Nova on Jan 12, 2023, 09:24 AMAlfheimRO is so pink and bubbly, when I entered their website and discord, it felt a bit like walking into the bedroom of a very girly teenage girl again, but without the excitement and anticipation. It was like I walked into a house made of pink bubblegum. It was so forcefully sweet, pink and bubbly wubbly that I turned 360 and just got out of there pretty much instantly without even trying the server out.
Quote from: Mammouth on Jan 14, 2023, 12:46 AMWhat saddens me the most is to know that the emulators (Rathena and Hercules) do not receive any donation from the RO community, and this same community is in adoration for gms who do very little mod. The difference in work is not even comparable, we compare a beach with a grain of sand, and yet it is the grain of sand that collects the donations