Haven't seen this kind of news in awhile. Thoughts?
http://renewal.playragnarok.com/news/newslist.aspx#n2224 (http://renewal.playragnarok.com/news/newslist.aspx#n2224)
I'd hate to be the poor sod at Gravity that has to wade through all that. Like having to clean sand off a beach /heh
I guess they will try to make examples of large servers and put the scare on everyone else. I figure emulators are fine from a legal standpoint, it's just the copyrighted assets/IP that's the trouble. I wonder if they have any recourse against non monetised servers.
Wonder why they're doing this now. They're about 15 years too late to tackle the swarms of pservs, lol. Maybe it's the last ditch attempt to save a sinking ship. Honestly I'm surprised they are still pulling a profit in 2022.
I have to say I like this quote though lol.
Quote
We encourage players to stay safe and to use official global Ragnarok Online services only, as it is unknown what standards of data protection which private servers may use and if user data will be properly safe.
Coming from the people who
region banned the whole of Europe rather than comply with GDPR /heh
Does anyone know server names that are getting sued?
I know the first ones they would go after are the ones that offer monthly subs and those hosting on Agies server file set like Kokoro and travels uses. Plus I am sure NFT servers are on that hunt list as well.
If only they spent the amount of money in legal action into actually developing their game properly huh? Crazy thought. Maybe listening to their players, not being a pay to win money grab bot friendly game.
I am curious as to how far their actions would actually go? There are so many private servers, not just in ragnarok. Time to take the link to my instagram off my server! lmao.
Quote from: lungo on Apr 21, 2022, 01:23 PM
Im going to enjoy so much seeing them go after the p2w servers LMAO same when they go for Origins.
Origins is probably in one of the better places right now given they don't take donations in any form, they're not using the RO logo and their homepage doesn't even mention the word Ragnarok, hahah. Being a big server puts them in the spotlight though and especially sharing the name of one of Grav's official projects. Servers running Aegis would probably be at the top of their hit list but then again the playerbase is so tiny in comparison I don't know if they'd bother. I also wonder if heavily customised / highrate servers are in a better place since they're not really gonna be competing for potential players like lowrates/classics are. When you've got thousands of pservs to potentially sue, which handful do you choose to go after?
Wonder if it's some licensing thing where they need to show that they're defending their IP. Realistically there's no way they can even make a dent in private servers and they're probably s*** out of luck if the host isn't in the US/Korea.
Didn't Gravity or Warpportal close down their official pre-renewal server?
If they did, they most likely can't even touch any of the pre-renewal private servers, legally, because it's a completely different game not being officially offered anymore.
It's like why Blizzard began offering their Classic WoW just so they can legally shut down any vanilla WoW private servers.
Unless I'm mistaken. I'd actually like to play an official version of Pre-renewal but I'm not into all that Ragnarok Zero crap.
Well, legally they don't need to offer something to public to have copyright on it.
It's just that it does not make much sense to invest money into something that doesn't net you money in the long run.
None of those 5000 "I hate renewal" pre-renewal players will play on official renewal servers even if Gravity managed to shut down 100% of all private servers.
Not to mention all of those who play on private servers only because they want to play together with friends that live on a different continent.
It really just seems like a waste of time and money unless Gravity has big plans to make RO great again.
I find that so hilarious.
After banning all of Europe from WarpPortal.
Killing off Re:Start then Transcendence.
And then they wonder where all their players vanished to.
I absolutely never ever will play on the russian "euRO" server, it's horrible
The french hoster was already bad (as they didn't care for a porper english translation) but at the same time tolerable still, as one good thing they did was active bot hunting. That made the server worth it to play on, knowing that bots had little to no chance there. But nope, Gravity accepted the russian hosters higher bid over the year long french partner they've had.
WarpPortal was my home for Ragnarok and right now I would probably even return there if they lifted the Europe ban, regardless of having lost my original account due to that.
PServers can be nice but they all come with the same big problem: Corruption and Favourism.
No exception. To some degree you are always at the mercy of tyrants or their close friends.
Still, right now I'd choose every pserver over the official russian "euRO" server they are trying to force me onto.
They are desperate and using scare tactics. /heh
You really think now after decades, they suddenly care? Now that their finances are in the s***, they're suddenly willing to sue pserver owners? /heh
Quote from: Herpderp on Apr 22, 2022, 08:27 AM
They are desperate and using scare tactics. /heh
You really think now after decades, they suddenly care? Now that their finances are in the s***, they're suddenly willing to sue pserver owners? /heh
Well, they are kind of proficient in taking offline their own servers though xD
I won't touch anything with a 100 foot pole that's "official", especially if it is hosted by WarpPortal. Not after getting banned from RE:Start because I "have a very bot-like name". /swt
Private server owners hosting from their home and volunteering their time without getting paid have more competent and caring staff than a company who is getting paid does. That speaks volumes to me.
Gravity doesn't understand that it's just like the Nintendo and piracy situation - if you want to offer something you need to be "better" than the competition. Nobody is going to pay money for a lesser experience when they can get a better, more authentic experience and service for free. Trying to sue private servers when they set their bar so low is like playing a doomed game of whack-a-mole.
I wouldn't play another official server even if they banned every single private server in existence.
They don't even currently offer a classic server on iRO and their latest failed venture, iRO Transcendence, closed after only a year of being filled with bots, RMT, and cheaters.
Do they just want classic players to play Chaos? No thanks, I'll go back to FFXIV or WoW.
I'm not sure why they posted those news now, when there have been private servers running for 20 years. It would be smarter to go after topsites, and even private server listing here on RMS, than it is to take down private servers. Though, I do expect it would be a DMCA notice instead of a straight lawsuit.
Either way they go at it.. people will still find a forum or community where private servers are advertised. Shutting down big servers will just push their communities to the next best private server. Rarely will they go to official servers.
Opening a private server literally takes a couple of hours of work.. and I imagine they will not be able to take down every server that pops up either.. as many measures can be taken to remain anonymous while hosting one.. especially in the web3 age, thanks to blockchain domains/hosting and crypto payments.
Their best bet is to really come up with a better product. Offer something that private servers are not offering or able to offer.
They need to focus their attention on what killed their official servers in the first place.. which are:
1. Easy to bot
2. No mechanism to ban computers, only accounts.
3. Pay to win
4. Rare GM interaction with players
5. Poor response to player suggestions
6. Inability to encrypt their sprites/files.
It's mind blowing that even after 20 years of private servers, they still have unencrypted grf and clients. If they were to encrypt their 3rd or even 4th job sprites before they released them, maybe people would of been forced to play official servers to enjoy those new classes.. but they failed at that too.
They could of also just focused their attention on their RO2 game... instead of continuing to expand the progression of a 20 years old game, where newbies need to play and/or pay for years in order to catch up and compete with veterans.
---I HAVE REMOVED THIS REPLY----
I remember seeing this a week or so ago and I didn't think anything of it. But I figured I would post my experience with this in an indirect kind of way.
I have a partnered Twitch account and Gravity DMCA'd me in the middle of me playing on Shining Moon and got me suspended for two days. And technically I know that streaming private servers is against Twitch's ToS, but I've been doing it since I've had my account (so like 7 years), but now it seems like Gravity is a bit more serious than we probably assumed about this.
So I would say to server owners, content creators, or streamers to be a bit more careful because Gravity seems to be a little quick on this now.
Not private servers directly, but a number of private server streamers were hit with copyright strikes by Gravity and had their channels suspended earlier today. So far it seems they might be taking this a bit more seriously than before. The question is - why now?
Rumour, talonRo has been downed
Quote from: Ashtaroth on May 04, 2022, 01:35 PM
Rumour, talonRo has been downed
Indeed, they withdrew out of fear of what might happen though.
owaa i see, so its not gravity work. Still, F.
Quote from: Kaeris on May 04, 2022, 04:22 AM
Not private servers directly, but a number of private server streamers were hit with copyright strikes by Gravity and had their channels suspended earlier today. So far it seems they might be taking this a bit more seriously than before. The question is - why now?
Not only suspended, but that butthurt WarpPortal employee went through their VODs and claimed a copyright strike on every P-Server Ragnarok VOD they had on there still, which means they surpassed all 3 strikes and got their Twitch Account instantly terminated FOREVER.
Which private servers did gravity go after??
Gravity is killing the game and it makes me sad.
Looks like this is it for NovaRO as well
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1U5YPd_geWBNh6ZEGatCdCf1KYBVImRDV (https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1U5YPd_geWBNh6ZEGatCdCf1KYBVImRDV)
I'm more worried about stuff like Talon going down etc. From these postings NovaRO even had a frickin LLC! Who's dumb enough to do that?
Thanks for ruining it for the rest of us.
Quote from: jacobo_bobo on Apr 22, 2022, 11:08 AM
They need to focus their attention on what killed their official servers in the first place.. which are:
1. Easy to bot
2. No mechanism to ban computers, only accounts.
3. Pay to win
4. Rare GM interaction with players
5. Poor response to player suggestions
6. Inability to encrypt their sprites/files.
Yes. I played on official server around 3 months ago (somewhere in south east asia), only to find bots everywhere. I tried to ignore it and play for 1 week, but in the end i give up. Then i played TalonRO, with zero bot and cheat, for 3 almost 3 months. And now its gone. And i wont go back to
that garbage called official server. /an /an /an
So is this it? Is this the end of RO private servers after a decade of basically keeping the game afloat and relevant?
Even if its a Pay2Win or Play2Win Server. But seeing them go down still hurts. I just started playing again on a Renewal Pserver and I'm loving it. Even uploading vids of it on my channel. Hope it's not taken down.
RO might die because of this.
Quote from: Bien11 on May 04, 2022, 11:22 PM
Even if its a Pay2Win or Play2Win Server. But seeing them go down still hurts. I just started playing again on a Renewal Pserver and I'm loving it. Even uploading vids of it on my channel. Hope it's not taken down.
RO might die because of this.
Agreed this is VERY scary no matter what your opinion on certain private servers is.
Unfortunately that doesnt seem to be up to the server owners
And I already noticed that Oath is delisted
A number of servers are being delisted, probably on request or voluntarily. A good move, assuming Gravity hasn't already done its homework.
stay low for now until their witch hunting stopped.
I delisted until this hopefully blows over. There's no reason to provoke a rabid dog right now.
I was wondering what had happened to the list. I checked Origins and they are delisted/gone as well.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RagnarokOnline/comments/uj7lxq/how_to_increase_the_population_of_your_game_ft/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/RagnarokOnline/comments/uj7lxq/how_to_increase_the_population_of_your_game_ft/)
A so it ends the age of Private Servers (hopefuly not).
You're so smart, Gravity.
It's a d1ck move for me when Gravity starting to sue and kill most private servers today. I get it they don't have rights to make a server since they have the copyright about RO files and everything. But let's be honest the main reason why Gravity sue them it's not because of the copyright but about how many players play their game. Players play on private server since most of them are play to win and some are play to earn with NFTS. It's their own fault why they lost players they jumped from play to win to pay to win. In Ragnarok Mobile, Ragnarok X: New Gen, Ragnarok Lost Memories and Labyrinth of Ragnarok at first it's easy to become strong but when days continues, and more updates comes the game the game became top-up dependant. I remember on Ragnarok Mobile they released a mount on auction that cost around $26,000. They even shut down Labyrinth of RO just to make it into Labyrith of RO NFT. Even if Gravity started suing Private servers time comes private server will still conquers them as players will quit the official games. They even can't do something about the mass bot and zeny bug on RO GGH. Some players manage to get 200m zeny in just a week because of the zeny bug.
D1ck move for Gravity.
Gravity is great again! After 20 yers!
Let's keep a list of the debacle to understand the scale of Gravity's greatness
1. TalonRO
2. Asgard Legend
3. RetRO
4. Ragnarok Travels
5. OriginsRO
6. ....?
Quote from: Kaeris on May 04, 2022, 04:22 AM
Not private servers directly, but a number of private server streamers were hit with copyright strikes by Gravity and had their channels suspended earlier today. So far it seems they might be taking this a bit more seriously than before. The question is - why now?
Several reasons but most important one; because they were reaching the important deadline of 20 years, after that they could have serious problems in several countries for a claim.
Now, they have another 20 years to do so and of course they need examples to establish it seriously and obvious they will take on the ones where it is easy and possible to accomplish.
Lawyers are not cheap, so there must be some prospects for Gravity other then just pumping in money in this 24/7 because in the end they have stakeholders to deal with.
So, low profile for a while, keep away from Renewal to avoid they pick you as target on occasion.
Quote from: Styx on May 09, 2022, 05:18 AM
Several reasons but most important one; because they were reaching the important deadline of 20 years, after that they could have serious problems in several countries for a claim.
Now, they have another 20 years to do so and of course they need examples to establish it seriously and obvious they will take on the ones where it is easy and possible to accomplish.
Lawyers are not cheap, so there must be some prospects for Gravity other then just pumping in money in this 24/7 because in the end they have stakeholders to deal with.
So, low profile for a while, keep away from Renewal to avoid they pick you as target on occasion.
Would actually be great if that was the main reason.
Gravity can originate non-cash shop server, Pre-renewal/Re-newal/Poring servers and try to earn money with something else like costumes, NFTs, events or, heck, even use my pc to mine Ethereum or something while I play my beloved original version of Ragnarok I used to play when I was 12 YO.
Quote from: Kattyjung on May 09, 2022, 10:06 PM
Gravity can originate non-cash shop server, Pre-renewal/Re-newal/Poring servers and try to earn money with something else like costumes, NFTs, events or, heck, even use my pc to mine Ethereum or something while I play my beloved original version of Ragnarok I used to play when I was 12 YO.
All of those are even more predatory than a cash shop. /swt
Like, I understand having a cash shop if it's going to be free to play; it's somewhat understandable. I think most people understand that too. The problem is that there needs to be a bit of give and take still. If you lean too far into the monetization, then there's not even any gameplay for the game you are playing anymore. The gameplay is merely the act of swiping your credit card. No reason to farm. No reason to speak to people and to form parties. No reason to do anything. RO is both a sandbox and a social game. You strip those two aspects away and shove them into the cash shop, what left is there to actually do?
Not to mention it destroys game balance. Good luck playing a support when anyone can just swipe a credit card and have a priest in their pocket with infinite HP/SP.
For me there are no big problems with the p2w, cash shop or bots on official servers because I mostly play solo now. And I play only PvE. I'm not really competing with other players, so don't care that there are god geared players around. I want a good economy on the server of course.
For me the main problem of the official servers is that they simply disappear even before the private servers. In my country, the official server existed for 10 years, then closed. Now we have opened a new official one, but without transferring the old characters. And they can close it at any moment again.
If they guaranteed by the very fact that this is a super puper Gravity corporation and their servers will never close, even if online drops to 10 people. Then I agree to play it and invest time. But they don't care about people, only their revenue from the server, stable or falls
Quote from: OldPoring on May 10, 2022, 08:51 AM
For me there are no big problems with the p2w, cash shop or bots on official servers because I mostly play solo now. And I play only PvE. I'm not really competing with other players, so don't care that there are god geared players around. I want a good economy on the server of course.
For me the main problem of the official servers is that they simply disappear even before the private servers. In my country, the official server existed for 10 years, then closed. Now we have opened a new official one, but without transferring the old characters. And they can close it at any moment again.
If they guaranteed by the very fact that this is a super puper Gravity corporation and their servers will never close, even if online drops to 10 people. Then I agree to play it and invest time. But they don't care about people, only their revenue from the server, stable or falls
The problem is that they have incentive to close servers after the short term -- or basically using their mobile strategy.
New server opens, players join, buy lots of stuff from the cash shop, then by a year, nobody's really buying anything anymore, they close up shop and re-open again, causing people to once again have to rebuy stuff.
It's basically the "pump and dump" strategy some nefarious private servers use.
It's funny to see all these servers closing while the only server being sued by Gravity is still up and running fine. /swt
If they are already sued, taking the server down could be seen as an admission of guilt or wrongdoing and would seen as a negative action in court.. so I understand why they haven't closed.
Other servers may have closed in order to reduce the chances of gravity still pursuing them with a lawsuit, which also makes sense for both gravity and private servers.
Quote from: rubie123 on May 25, 2022, 06:00 AM
It's funny to see all these servers closing while the only server being sued by Gravity is still up and running fine. /swt
A fair number of them were looking for an out, for various reasons.
contents removed due to sensitivity.
Any update on the Gravity incident?
Quote from: Butt Force on May 31, 2022, 09:51 AM
A fair number of them were looking for an out, for various reasons.
Hard to say that when all the servers that matter closed. For the server that got sued it doesnt make sense to close after already being sued because thats admitting guilt so it makes sense theyre still up
I am speaking specifically of drama-savaged servers with catastrophically low populations. There's no point in naming names, they're definitely not coming back.
Drama-savaged servers with catastrophically low populations are all thats left at this point
That is objectively false. Look a little harder. Visit some discords. Personally, I love the server I'm on, and the population is blowing up. Of course, I understand lowrate isn't for everyone.
In an environment where 7-8k players were suddenly displaced due to all the server closures 200 pop with half of those being afk venders isn't really blowing up. It's pretty dead
You are pulling those numbers far, far out of your buttocks. The total number of servers that shut down couldn't have had been hosting more than 2k total active players, period, when you allow for multi-clienters, and you appear to be playing some other Oath. Most of the servers that have closed had active median member counts numbered in the low double digits.
More important than any of this: what you're looking at is the natural evolution of a private server community. There always, and I mean always, comes a time when the rights holder of the title goes s***, typically in a moment of weakness, and attacks their own fanbase. It happened with World of Warcraft. I'm confused it took this long for Gravity to wake up, honestly.
The end-state is private servers hosted in countries that completely ignore takedown requests and offer no legal remedy to companies seeking to enforce IP rights of any kind, run by people who keep their identities hidden. All of this has happened before in other games. There's nothing IP holders can do to stop it. It happened to WoW, now it's happening to Ragnarok. It sucks that we lost some good servers. Life goes on, and so does the private server scene.
You'll get over your personal loss. I did.
Sol*** alone was 2k players. The only thing up a buttocks seems to be your own head.
Servers can hide in strange countries but it also means almost no players. You are going through the denial phase, you'll get over it
Damn that's crazy. Nova getting sued, Talon and Solace gone. What other servers closed?
I really hope this is not the end for our cute game.
Now that September has nearly gone, what does the situation look like?
Quote from: Tzuridis on Sep 27, 2022, 08:45 PM
Now that September has nearly gone, what does the situation look like?
I would like to know too.
I often open very tiny servers just for hobby but currently I was so scare of Gravity.