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Author Topic: Do you feel like RO's dungeons should have more structure to them?  (Read 3297 times)

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Offline michaelsoftman

Just a curious thought I had.  RO has plenty of dungeons, but many are open ended like the overworld.  Meaning you can warp to any floor (based on the server of course), farm mobs and bosses as you please.  To me, they end up feeling like just another map, instead of a dungeon to explore.

So I had a thought I felt like bringing up and seeing what other people thought.  Should RO's dungeons all be structured to be more of an adventure?  If the dungeons were instanced, and you always started at the first level, you could design a lot more in them like putting in mobs at certain locations rather than having them roam randomly, adding in instanced quests, changing the dungeon based on party size or solo play.

Some examples I thought of:
-A dead end could lead to a treasure chest or an ambush of mobs that only spawn once you walk in. Adding on to that, you could add a bonus chest that only gives loot if a thief class opens it, to make it seem like they are picking a lock. (Also no one likes to invite thieves to parties  /sob)
-You can have more mobs spawn the more players are in the party, or make things easier for a single player.
-You can make puzzles, like needing to hit switches in the right order, or kill certain mobs while avoiding others, etc.
-You could have an instanced quest where if you fulfill an objective, when it's time to fight the dungeon boss, it'd spawn in with less HP than normal, making it easier to defeat. Or, let's take Garm for example.  Defeat all the Garm Baby mobs on the map first, and an alternate Garm spawns in with higher atk but lower def (it's enraged). So you can choose which one you want to fight every time you do the dungeon.
-Maybe even an alternate path, like if you defeat a miniboss on floor 1, the warp takes you to an alternate floor 2 with more rewards or rarer mobs. Some rainbow plants for ygg drops?
-Since you can attach a script to the boss this way, you can have it talk as it loses HP via local broadcasts, or even add in alternate AI this way.  Like getting Maya to 50% HP, she calls for backup and has a one time summon of 20 ants to assist her.

All of these would work best by far if dungeons were instances rather than open maps. I always liked the idea of exploring dungeons, and the possibility to find hidden secrets.  What does everyone think?

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Offline yC

The dungeons in RO, yes they are mostly like just another map in a darker place, they are made for grinding so there is nothing special in them.  The other "dungeons" with special features and storyline are in the instance or memorial dungeons.  I think RO made it clear in that sense somewhat, the instance can be for group explore / team up to beat MVPs while the dungeons are well ... solo-able.

Offline Bullet

Just a curious thought I had.  RO has plenty of dungeons, but many are open ended like the overworld.  Meaning you can warp to any floor (based on the server of course), farm mobs and bosses as you please.  To me, they end up feeling like just another map, instead of a dungeon to explore.

So I had a thought I felt like bringing up and seeing what other people thought.  Should RO's dungeons all be structured to be more of an adventure?  If the dungeons were instanced, and you always started at the first level, you could design a lot more in them like putting in mobs at certain locations rather than having them roam randomly, adding in instanced quests, changing the dungeon based on party size or solo play.

Some examples I thought of:
-A dead end could lead to a treasure chest or an ambush of mobs that only spawn once you walk in. Adding on to that, you could add a bonus chest that only gives loot if a thief class opens it, to make it seem like they are picking a lock. (Also no one likes to invite thieves to parties  /sob)
-You can have more mobs spawn the more players are in the party, or make things easier for a single player.
-You can make puzzles, like needing to hit switches in the right order, or kill certain mobs while avoiding others, etc.
-You could have an instanced quest where if you fulfill an objective, when it's time to fight the dungeon boss, it'd spawn in with less HP than normal, making it easier to defeat. Or, let's take Garm for example.  Defeat all the Garm Baby mobs on the map first, and an alternate Garm spawns in with higher atk but lower def (it's enraged). So you can choose which one you want to fight every time you do the dungeon.
-Maybe even an alternate path, like if you defeat a miniboss on floor 1, the warp takes you to an alternate floor 2 with more rewards or rarer mobs. Some rainbow plants for ygg drops?
-Since you can attach a script to the boss this way, you can have it talk as it loses HP via local broadcasts, or even add in alternate AI this way.  Like getting Maya to 50% HP, she calls for backup and has a one time summon of 20 ants to assist her.

All of these would work best by far if dungeons were instances rather than open maps. I always liked the idea of exploring dungeons, and the possibility to find hidden secrets.  What does everyone think?
i really really love this idea! this sounds more fun and ways for balance (need thief party opportunities).
but at the same time, im not sure personally have the time to re-learn heavy customs for a old game. im settling for classics which im familiar with the settings. Would definitely joined this type of server 10 years ago...

Offline plarr

No, mostly if the dungeon was linear then you're far from a good dungeon design. They should pretty much be almost endless with the rewards being difficult to obtain while farming.

Pretty much, maps are set to respawn a monster when a monster is killed randomly, but farming a certain monster means you'll benefit from the items you can obtain, but some maps are really more difficult than other maps. This makes the adventure, just getting items can be good, I think that is why the add in passive mobs, but none of them ever drop anything significant and it also seems most of the items released have been made with the idea of actually increasing the raw power player will get, and have very little rewards after you get them. It almost doesn't work.

Offline Naruto

Flee was really good in pre renewal

Hunter scaled off the accuracy stat ( dex ) for damage and AGI was already a meh stat to grab cause you would lose STR or DEX on any other class

Limited you to picking something you wanted to farm and stay there for 10000 kills...



like right now im stuck at seals for 20 more base levels on transcendence server with my assassin


Also about your alternate pathing you canot re calculate the original light maps so unless you want a different looking IRO map then your screwed
« Last Edit: Mar 20, 2021, 04:30 pm by Naruto »

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Offline Playtester

I personally wouldn't want structured dungeons in an MMORPG. MMORPGs for me are all about the exploration. I don't want a progress-driven dungeon experience like in most JRPGs.

That being said, it's definitely kind of lame that you can easily teleport deeper into dungeons, that's why my friends and me usually go with the "no teleport" rule. This definitely gives some sense of accomplishment when beating a dungeon.

I'd actually be interested in an MMORPG that offers dungeons so large that even after years of exploration not all corners have been found yet. If you have a "wide" enough dungeon design, then you could even remove any teleportation from it. Just knowing the right way will allow you to get deeper faster then.

Offline plarr

Well, if you're considering using flee as a outline to a dungeon, most flee rated characters are absolutely great at doing content, but for a hunter, he could never really achieve the same.

They almost need either to take down a enemy with double strafe, or the target has to be immobile, the maps with immobile characters are so scarce, I dislike using my hunter if I do not have some type of item for fleeing or evasion. So, he sits at level 60 in prontera. So, high flee rated maps are not for everyone... /wah

Offline plarr

So, I guess I am staying no, they do not need more structure, I actually don't know why they started creating instances in the game when they are or were not necessary, in fact I think games like black desert maybe are going more traditional with the  open maps and grinds, which is the only thing I knew ragnarok was good for.