Quote from: ragnafiles on Mar 18, 2024, 04:41 PMMichielnummerloos
Quote from: Felione on Mar 23, 2024, 12:36 PMI'm informing people of mistakes and issues surrounding a problem. I wouldn't really call that democratic. I also provided proven solutions through comparison. What exactly am I doing wrong on a forum that discusses servers where you are allowed to state your own opinion? I don't have to think about anything but my own opinion of a product I chose to consume for a time before I dropped it. No one's feelings is a part of this, nor is defending the idea that it's difficult to start a server for "free". It is a risk, which comes with obvious consequences. The way you act as an admin reflects if people will stay, or people will go, and I believe people need to be informed of someone's discretion, observe it themselves, and make a decision. If I was the sole person who dictated whether someone plays a server, I would never type a word on this forum, but the beauty of being an individual, is that I can write a novel of terrible and negative things, and people could simply ignore it. I think the reason why anything I say bothers anyone, is because it's very direct and to the point. If any issue exists, it needs to be pointed out, or nothing will be fixed. It's that simple. If it's not fixed? well, the appropriate actions are taken by a playerbase.Oh please, this was never about whether you're allowed to state your mind in a public forum, so don't twist it like that. It's the assumption that admins out there not just ought to, but have to listen to inputs lest they be labeled a close-minded brute who hold their community in low esteem.
My main issue with server owners continuing the way they do, is, it leads to failure, and unfortunately, the only victims are the PLAYERS who wasted their time, something MONEY can't buy, on a person's poor decisive skills. If you have a vision of something, giving the players small amounts of compassion wouldn't hurt you or your vision, but some people are just childish and refuse to see anything else. I know this from experience, because I'm a writer, and after showing my work to people, I was given advice I thought was terrible, and some I thought were good. Did I sulk in a corner? did I put my foot down and declare war on ideas? no. I simply adapted a massive change, which forced me to rewrite hundreds of hours of text, so that it was more presentable towards a certain audience, WHILE keeping things as close to my vision as I could.
If I, someone with a low self-esteem, who is normally rather fragile, can take the advice of people who dislike my work, a server owner can make a consideration for their donations. I personally don't get it. This type of game is dead without a community, so why on earth would you grudge over your community's advice and quite possibly their needs to stay? it's mind boggling that I have to write this, like it needed to be explained.
Quote from: Felione on Mar 23, 2024, 12:36 PMMy main issue with server owners continuing the way they do, is, it leads to failure, and unfortunately, the only victims are the PLAYERS who wasted their time, something MONEY can't buy, on a person's poor decisive skills. If you have a vision of something, giving the players small amounts of compassion wouldn't hurt you or your vision, but some people are just childish and refuse to see anything else. I know this from experience, because I'm a writer, and after showing my work to people, I was given advice I thought was terrible, and some I thought were good. Did I sulk in a corner? did I put my foot down and declare war on ideas? no. I simply adapted a massive change, which forced me to rewrite hundreds of hours of text, so that it was more presentable towards a certain audience, WHILE keeping things as close to my vision as I could.
Quote from: Felione on Mar 23, 2024, 12:36 PMIf I, someone with a low self-esteem, who is normally rather fragile, can take the advice of people who dislike my work, a server owner can make a consideration for their donations. I personally don't get it. This type of game is dead without a community, so why on earth would you grudge over your community's advice and quite possibly their needs to stay? it's mind boggling that I have to write this, like it needed to be explained.
Quote from: Metan on Mar 23, 2024, 09:30 AMThat said, I agree with yC and Blitzen. People (not just Felione, but the general sort who take their own takes to another degree) seriously need to sit down, chill and think what exactly in the world they're doing, acting like that.
Quote from: Playtester on Mar 23, 2024, 05:13 AMYou might think that RO players are all negative, but the truth is that all positive RO players just enjoy the game and won't bother posting here (or anywhere really).I think it's about the subject, rather than the place(s). I believe I'm a positive kind of player in that I'm aware my suggestions are just suggestions and my opinions are just opinions, and I understand that admins have their own visions and ways of handling things (which I may my own perspective on -- but again, an opinion), but here I am.
Quote from: Playtester on Mar 23, 2024, 05:13 AMI also think it's a misconception that server owners (or game developers in general) should always cater to the players. Sometimes, you just want to make your own vision and it doesn't really matter much to you if the majority wants it or not. It's basically just "Here I made this thing I personally want to play and if you coincidentally like the same thing, feel free to enjoy it too".Definitely. Sometimes I wonder if this isn't a byproduct of people getting so addicted to the idea of democracy that they think everything around them ought to work as such, including places that are obviously not democratic (like a RO server, which often works like "my way or the highway"), which leads to people getting seriously upset that their ideas, which they're so sure are magnificent, are not heard. I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out like some cultural/political explanation like this is the key, because the truth is that this is not unique to RO. I've seen it only too much over the internet.
As a consumer the only thing you're entitled to is to decide whether you want to consume the product or not. Of course you can always give suggestions, but these should just help the creator see things they didn't consider for their vision and not force them to change their vision.
Quote from: yC on Mar 22, 2024, 11:41 PMFor the first time I feel I have to agree with Blinzer that we should appreciate RO servers more and stop the hate and negativity.
If a server is operating fine, with minimal bug and non-corrupt, what's not to like? Keep in mind it is a free service. If you don't like the balancing or the direction it is going, don't force yourself into it because it will end up in pain and more hate. You can leave it alone or find somewhere else you like. It definitely isn't the only server in town.
Rather than going on all hate mode and try everything to kill the server, you can even try to run your own server if you think you can do a better job and see how far it go.
I am not talking about this particular server or any server or to anyone. Just making a general statement regarding the state of the community being too negative sometimes.
For one successful server there are 100 that fails, treat it as if someone won the lottery if that will make you feel better. Do we hate the one winning? Well maybe .. sometimes .. nooo but we don't try to ruin their life and wish them die right? Don't be so negative and we will be a happier community.
Do you think when someone start a server, they know how much they will gain or loss from the start? Nobody will estimate that because projection will always fail, I can tell you 50% of the success of a server is based on luck (or uncontrollable factors). But server owners are the ones willing to take a chance, put in the efforts to make their dream server alive. Whatever happen after is unpredictable.
One of the unpredictable is the shape of the community. Either the server attract friendly lovely folks or become the base of toxic haters is not the fault of the server and is beyond anyone's control. This is a hot issue, it often take the most energy to deal with on top of the day to day issue arise in a server.
Please understand you are not the only one very important player of a server and must be served first. You might be one of the (toxic or non-toxic) players that have an issue, contacted (harassed or blamed) the staff and waiting for a response. To the friendly folks, I am sure staying with a positive attitude will make the server staff feel the community is worth their time. To the haters, the server do not owe you anything and you are free to quit.
If we don't re-think our attitude toward servers/staff, start to be more considerate and appreciate the work that was put in. As well as the work put into the free emulators such as eAthena, rAthena and Hercules to keep these projects alive and updated in the last 20+ years. YOU will be the one left to run a server, if your answer is "hell no" then you realize how much damage has been done.
Of course the same goes around, if server treat player like trash, we will have no players. Then we will all left with the official server.
Quote from: Blinzer on Mar 19, 2024, 11:39 AMRO players are so negative lol.
Quote from: Gulielmus on Mar 22, 2024, 09:47 PMI'm also curious as you, why s/he is still here.