My thoughts on RO's job system/division/balance

Mathy · May 05, 2010, 08:50 PM

I love this game. It's awesome. Since I played it, I started comparing it to every new thing I play. I like it that much, but there are some things that I dislike about it's system.

-Asura. To dodge it, you need to cast SW or Hide. Against SW, the Monk/Champion can use Pneuma. Vs Hide, Maya Purple and that Box thingie will do the trick. (I believe switching to GR is a good way to tank it. Am I right?)
-Any class other than Asura Champ, AD Bioche and eventually Wizard won't be very effective against an MvP. Some strong monsters like Valkyrie will die easily but slowly for a Sniper/Last Stand Gunslinger with a High Priest tanking. Jobs like Assassin are worthless except for tanking mob.
-The Priest class. They made killing Undeads (I love killing these guys in any game) a task as easy as casting a 1 sec skill. No need to hit them hard or anything. Or even better. Use a Demon/Undead-killing AoE skill that deals great damage. Did Gravity think they were balancing Priests by making them kill just 2 types of monster effectively? Instead, they made it an unrewarding task to kill them with a melee class. Also, Priests are the best tanks (this should be a Knight or Crusader's job) and the most valuable support class, to a point where not being buffed by one makes you a lot weaker.
-Need for a brewing char. You shouldn't brew with the same Alche you use to kill or forge with the same Blacksmith you pack a punch. No. Instead, you have to make a whole new build to use Pharmacy. They could have used this system: chances affected by base and job level and equipment stat bonus only. That would increase this classes' awesomeness. Same for Deadly Poison.
-Forging was made useless after Endows.
-A skill as great as Soul Burner is all about luck.

Yeah, some of these arguments are fail, some of them actually make sense. This is my first post here and I'm not sure this is the right section, but, again, I just wanted to tell eveyone what I think and possibly get some comments on it.
Yes, please tell me what you don't like about the current balance between jobs and what I shouldn't even bother about.

Sarin · May 05, 2010, 10:38 PM

Well, no offense, but looking through it, how long you've been playing on lowrates? Not long I guess...

1. Asura is quite a tricky stuff. Hidedodge is possible even against maya p., as players in hide can be targeted and hit only by earth elemental skills/spells. Neutral reductions help a lot too, and with good gear and good vit, asura is surviveable on at least 50% chars.
2. Not exactly true. They are limited to non-ghost MvPs and those that don't have Pneuma or SW in case of Champ. Besides, even with that...MvPing isn't the only thing in the RO world...for farming non-boss stuff, for example, these suck hard time.
3. Well, Priests need something to kill to level, there isn't always party around. They're not the best tanks either...they can tank damn well, true, but Paladin with proper build and gear or LK will do the job better, especially when tanking more than one kind of mob.
4. Most servers have resetter, and there are ways around it anyway...like Marionette control.
5. There isn't always Sage around...and forged weapons are permanent. In long run, they are less expensive than s*** of elemental stones.
6. That is because it is SO great. It would be far overkill to make it 100% success, since profs would be able to pretty much disable and keep disabled anyone.

There is a lot of issues in RO balance...but what you pointed out aren't those.

Sev · May 05, 2010, 11:59 PM

I think you're pretty much half way there on all of your points.
If you think classes like assassins are good for nothing other than tank, which they're not, then you should probably play them more?

It seems like you're doing a lot of solo play even though RO is definitely designed to be team oriented.

fluidin · May 06, 2010, 12:01 AM

-what sarin said. note that ruwach/sight will screw ur hide dodge up too. the best bet against champs isn't in a 1v1 situation, but GvG one. also, LKs and Sinxs, apart from Palas, can now also reflect champs to death with +7 or higher valk mants, provided they are of high vit/hp.

-MvPing at the high tiers needs multiple jobs in a party to be done right. u will learn that most classes are included in the bigger scheme of things as u go on

-priests aren't tanks. you might feel that way now, but probably not in the future. they are also not the most valuable support class (hi profs), but they are close. but yes, people do need priest buffs. nothing wrong there

-no comment
-no comment
-profs have better things to do in WoE other than soul burn, even if it was 100% success. but yes, it would be overkill in smaller scale/pvp battles, what with 9c range and spamming it in strings.

what i would like to say is, RO isn't about each class being able to do things, with some doing them slightly better than others. (hint: WoW) no. Each class has a specific role, and they are overpowered in their own roles. that's why, only when u bring them together in WoE, with each side having all said classes, will there be balance. And the battles certainly are intriguing, when u see each contrasting role melding together perfectly.

Anti-Static Foam Cleaner · May 06, 2010, 01:09 AM

I would say that, with proper build, Priests are indeed best tanks when on their own. If support of another Priest is available though, and it almost always is, Knights, Crusaders or even Monks with Mental Strength are better.

It's odd you didn't mention a SinX. Crusader's HP mod, Hunter's SP mod, insane flee bonuses, ability to attack when hidden(and it's an AoE skill no less), Sonic Blow which can be buffed like four times and can kill almost any class in one hit, ability to wield two weapons, steal, double attack, hide, ice pick, blah blah blah

mahawirasd · May 06, 2010, 01:45 AM

each class, each build has their uses/roles.
sinX (with the proper gear and party settings) can be essential to high end mvps too...

i'm not saying that there is such a thing as class balance in RO... far from it, you would notice that the most populous class in most (if not every) servers are HPs and snipers... for good reason too. If you want an all-round easy to play hard to screw up pvm class you go with snipers. If you want an essential role in parties, or fast levelling without any equips then you go with HPs...

it's all because as a first class, heal for an all int aco and DS for an all dex archer is the best damage vs sp cost (which shows your exp gain potential) skill there is... and they become skills that are still used most often even when you're a 99/70 sniper or HP... so really, if you want class balance, RO is probably not the game for you...

-w-

LemonCrosswalk · May 06, 2010, 04:01 AM

Quote from: Mathy on May 05, 2010, 08:50 PM
-The Priest class. They made killing Undeads (I love killing these guys in any game) a task as easy as casting a 1 sec skill. No need to hit them hard or anything. Or even better. Use a Demon/Undead-killing AoE skill that deals great damage. Did Gravity think they were balancing Priests by making them kill just 2 types of monster effectively? Instead, they made it an unrewarding task to kill them with a melee class. Also, Priests are the best tanks (this should be a Knight or Crusader's job) and the most valuable support class, to a point where not being buffed by one makes you a lot weaker.

This made me laugh. There are only a few things that can be killed by healing, and even then if you're not a priest there are BETTER things to kill at that level.

And if basic mobs give you a sense of satisfaction after you kill them, then you must be easily entertained.

Mathy · May 07, 2010, 04:45 PM

Healing? I'm talking about TU and ME. They are the best ways to kill Undead and, for ME, Demons too.
Basic mob? I just enjoy killing monsters tagged as "Undead" in any game. I think it's cool.
And I haven't mentioned SiXs because a) I'm showing you some points and seeing if people agree with them, not making a deep analysis of class balance; b) they are my first class of choice since nat critical sins were the best WoE build, so I know most of their weaknesses.

ore0s · May 11, 2010, 03:49 PM

Quote-Asura. To dodge it, you need to cast SW or Hide. Against SW, the Monk/Champion can use Pneuma. Vs Hide, Maya Purple and that Box thingie will do the trick. (I believe switching to GR is a good way to tank it. Am I right?)

On the official server, a fully geared Asura Champion will not be able to kill a fully geared LK/Paladin/Bard/High Priest/Sinx. Rarely see an Asura Champion kill anything on a 99/70 either because of the skill Assumptio + Diabolus Set. Asura Champions are so easy they're the first class I usually harass in PvP...The only problem is that they're annoying if there is a Healer right next to the PvP Warper.

Quote-Any class other than Asura Champ, AD Bioche and eventually Wizard won't be very effective against an MvP. Some strong monsters like Valkyrie will die easily but slowly for a Sniper/Last Stand Gunslinger with a High Priest tanking. Jobs like Assassin are worthless except for tanking mob.

I'll have to disagree with this, if you have a DD Sinx with the right cards Clown, Paladin and a HP, you'll be able to take down almost all the original MvPS. You have to realize that these MvPs were meant to be done in a party on a 99/70.

Quote-The Priest class. They made killing Undeads (I love killing these guys in any game) a task as easy as casting a 1 sec skill. No need to hit them hard or anything. Or even better. Use a Demon/Undead-killing AoE skill that deals great damage. Did Gravity think they were balancing Priests by making them kill just 2 types of monster effectively? Instead, they made it an unrewarding task to kill them with a melee class. Also, Priests are the best tanks (this should be a Knight or Crusader's job) and the most valuable support class, to a point where not being buffed by one makes you a lot weaker.

If you get the Yggdrasil Leaf, anyone can kill Undead monsters in 1 sec if you're lucky O_o.