So what's with RO servers these days? Most of em gives too much freebies and sometimes, if a player didn't got what he wanted (particularly on freebies) they'll quit nor even start complaining and say ' this RO sucks! ' lol
More like being a bias is one effective way to get players now? @_@ /hmm
I know! I don't offer freebies on my server because I think it takes away from the game itself, and a couple times a day I'll have a player who turns up, asks for freebies, then leaves when there aren't any. :| Half the fun of the game is working to get what you want, in my opinion. The "freebie culture" is breeding a new species of player that requires instant gratification, and this is harmful to the Ragnarok Online community as a whole.
Oh right, RO servers now is all about how good the freebies is lol
That's seriously ridiculous XD
EDIT: I'd also say 80% of RO players now are lazy asses and depends on what freebies the RO got
Part of this is probably because of how often players hop to a new server in general. They've played so many servers before, they want to have an easier time getting into the new one so they can just get to the "fun part" of late-game activities.
My server does have a set of freebies, but not nearly to the degree of other servers. We just give some basic items like a few starter gears for farming.
I find it particularly interesting to see people complaining about this on my server, since we're a super high rate and it's already pretty easy to get most stuff LOL. Players are just used to other servers spoon-feeding them now, though, so that's what they expect from everyone else. Personally I don't have much concern for people who leave because we're not the same as every other server - the whole point in making a server was for it to be different, and I think that's something every other server needs to keep in mind as well. What players expect isn't always what's best.
Any high rate / super high rate servers don't even need freebies anymore tho or should i say there's really no need for freebies in any style of RO, but yeah freebies for hunting is more than enough. I can even start with just a simple knife [3] and cotton shirts, with that it doesn't break my gaming and challenge.
It's very hard to find players who seeks challenge on the server, thus those ' spoon-feed me please ' players are the ones changing your RO's style of gaming to the point that they want it exactly as they want, or else quit lol
The only freebies new players really need are novice potions. Any more than that is ugh.
Also, isn't EVERYTHING (except maybe OP donor gear) practically freebies in SHRs? I guess it's too much effort for these players, gotta hand it to them from the very start eh?
Quote from: Perry the Platypus on Jun 12, 2015, 07:59 AM
Part of this is probably because of how often players hop to a new server in general. They've played so many servers before, they want to have an easier time getting into the new one so they can just get to the "fun part" of late-game activities.
This just resumes what's happening.
To be honest, RO is an old game and we're not 15 years old with that much free time anymore. But, truth be told, "freebies" is not the way to go.
I'd rather go with algorithmic drops with somehow "high" rates for what it's a low rate. I feel it really weird that every server boosts experience rate and not drops rate, making the fun part (leveling, getting new skills and partying) go too fast and making the boring part (getting equipment, cards, etc) even more boring. Basically, you level up a character to get gear instead of the other way around.
Quote from: Yozakura on Jun 12, 2015, 01:09 PMAlso, isn't EVERYTHING (except maybe OP donor gear) practically freebies in SHRs? I guess it's too much effort for these players, gotta hand it to them from the very start eh?
Not necessarily, depends on how the server is set up. Most of the "main" gear/items are really easy to get, but I still like having the option to get slightly better equips by putting a bit of effort in. Lazy/casual players can still PvP/BG/WoE effectively without putting too much effort into gearing up, while other players who don't mind doing some larger quests or otherwise putting time into their build can get a slight edge.
Quote from: Perry the Platypus on Jun 12, 2015, 02:25 PM
Not necessarily, depends on how the server is set up. Most of the "main" gear/items are really easy to get, but I still like having the option to get slightly better equips by putting a bit of effort in. Lazy/casual players can still PvP/BG/WoE effectively without putting too much effort into gearing up, while other players who don't mind doing some larger quests or otherwise putting time into their build can get a slight edge.
Reminds me of that SHR server named Hyo-RO with max level of 5000 lol
And still it's challenging because the quest requirements of the custom items really just matches with the server's rate and set up.
But generally speaking, i guess majority of people who wants OP freebies are at 255/100 servers.
There is a particular group of people, or a nationality, that likes freebies and begging for items but I won't name it. Not being racist but it's simply a fact that it is engraved on their online gaming culture.
Well when the average life span of a server is 3 months people tend to not want to grind the same garbage they've been doing for the last 10 years. This is why mid+ rates have been so popular.
Quote from: wpcarlos on Jun 14, 2015, 05:03 AM
There is a particular group of people, or a nationality, that likes freebies and begging for items but I won't name it. Not being racist but it's simply a fact that it is engraved on their online gaming culture.
Those group probably has more underage players or something then (I see lots of begging in Runescape which is mostly American and European players). I've seen plenty of BRs/Pinoys who would grind like as if it was their job.
And probably i guess when people think about it's a " private server ", items and stuffs should be easy and free (of course compared to official servers)
There's just too many servers active right now. Players are torn between which servers to play, and server owners are trying to bait players by these stupid freebies that doesn't really help the server in the long run.
I really hate how easy it is to make your own server nowadays, the amount of incompetent admins or staff out there right now is too darn high. I really miss the better times where there were limited number of servers that you can actually choose from because it actually takes skills and proper knowledge to make a server.
Quote from: Nitrate on Jun 15, 2015, 01:09 AM
There's just too many servers active right now. Players are torn between which servers to play, and server owners are trying to bait players by these stupid freebies that doesn't really help the server in the long run.
I really hate how easy it is to make your own server nowadays, the amount of incompetent admins or staff out there right now is too darn high. I really miss the better times where there were limited number of servers that you can actually choose from because it actually takes skills and proper knowledge to make a server.
IMO it's also because those incompetent admins just think about money.
That's very common now these days, that admins only make RO server because they think they'll make lots of money from it.
Quote from: Mary Magdalene on Jun 15, 2015, 01:56 AM
IMO it's also because those incompetent admins just think about money.
That's very common now these days, that admins only make RO server because they think they'll make lots of money from it.
^ This. The amount of people I've had that were surprised when I wouldn't let them donate for a GM position or some kind of overpowered/unobtainable item is...slightly concerning to me. Doesn't surprise me at all that they'd ask, but it's worrying when they're surprised that I say no.
I wonder how many of you would actually take the time to try to find a server that is not like that.
Quote from: Blinzer on Jun 15, 2015, 10:25 AM
I wonder how many of you would actually take the time to try to find a server that is not like that.
@Blinzer
It was never mentioned in this thread that there are no proper private servers these days. We know that we can still find good servers out there. The discussion now is how "most" private servers are like this, what aspects affect these severs, etc.
On topic:
I really would love to see the day when RMS would start to regulate private server listing and give priority to those servers that had actually stood for a long time instead of newly formed ones. Maybe add a filter that would tag a certain server as a new one or an old one, with wipes taken into consideration.
Quote from: Nitrate on Jun 15, 2015, 10:55 AM
I really would love to see the day when RMS would start to regulate private server listing and give priority to those servers that had actually stood for a long time instead of newly formed ones. Maybe add a filter that would tag a certain server as a new one or an old one, with wipes taken into consideration.
Sort by date already exists on RMS listings, at least I think that you're talking about the "Sort Results By: Date Posted", but if you think that it can be improved, you can suggest it to yC at http://forum.ratemyserver.net/suggestionsrequests/ (http://forum.ratemyserver.net/suggestionsrequests/)
I hope I'll see a description on a new private server that do not offer freebies / guild package or probably has considerable freebies like potions only lol.
[ Or probably there are some but I'm just too busy to search em ]
Quote from: Nitrate on Jun 15, 2015, 10:55 AM
I really would love to see the day when RMS would start to regulate private server listing and give priority to those servers that had actually stood for a long time instead of newly formed ones.
And +1 for this
Damn interesting topic. Make rms account, so that i can reply on this.
For the first time i play this game, it already stuck in my heart. Make me want to play ro more and more. But due to my busy life (damn school), i missed it. So after few years, im back and it already dead /omg (not really, but with emergence of so damn many bots and inflation zeny, i consider it dead already). College time, i tried my first private server. i feel so cool playing it that time. but again quit due to busy in college /sob . Then renewal, 3rd job coming. My first thought > New update. Cool! I want play it again. So i started play it again. Now, i playing it awhile, then quit, search new pserver again. So, basically i play alot of pserver already. I still cant find good pserver for me. Even now, i keep search good pserver in rms once and awhile.
K done with the introduction /heh . My point is all pserver is the same. Thats why i only playing it awhile, then quit, search new pserver again. No pserver that can attract me for more than 2 weeks. I really want to play ro, but there is no trigger factor to play it again. For me that trigger factor are:
1. New update
All pserver almost the same. No new mobs. The different is renewal and pre-renewal only. There is no totally new update. Like from pre-renewal to renewal (although that renewal totally messed up /heh), but that also make me want to play it more. Even other games, waht u want the most is new update content. Not just some remake new town, skill balancing (damn, it important also!), or same mobs with new colour.
2. Gameplay availability
First, in terms of solo or party mobbing. I more prefer solo mobbing, but sometimes i like party with other player also. In pserver, what i can say, low rate= party playing (u cant survive without party like lvling in cursed abbey), high rate = solo playing (why party if can solo). Second, in terms of mvp and unbalance class. I really want mvp that easy to kill while in party (Not too easy like in renewal, normal atk also can kill it), and also can be solo but much harder and take longer time to kill (Not too hard, 1 hit kill, atleast can tank it. I think it can be achieved if mvp deals dmg based on %hp). Each account also should be limit on mvp. Why the f*** same ppl keep killing mvp non-stop just because he/she more stronger than others? Thats 1 more reason why ppl keep change to new pserver just to conquer it. Myb they can kill it, but make item from mvp lootable 1 time only by that same ppl. Mvp will spawn back if item doesnt being loot. It giv more chance for other ppl to kill it.
3. End game content
First, lvling and then mvp. Some pserver has some crazy quest just to get 1 eq for end game, like 1000 fluffy /omg , or some pserver need rare mvp eq just to kill noob mvp. How the heck we get it if we cant even kill mvp that had it? /swt Low tier mvp should be manageable to kill and drop item to make greater eq to farm high tier mvp, or just make some eq droppable by mini boss or normal mobs.
4. Donation
Always overpower! Just make unnecessary items,such as bubble gums as donation item also ok. Please stop making end game item as donation item, stop it! Well, it include all those extreme +100 all stat wing in midrate server /wah
Damn, freebies we all /kis freebies. Why so many ppl hate it? /... Just dont make it too overpower or affect end game playing. I got so many more in my mind, but lost it while typing all this. /omg Sorry, for my noob english /heh
Quote from: dreamzky on Jun 16, 2015, 10:09 AMDamn, freebies we all /kis freebies. Why so many ppl hate it? /... Just dont make it too overpower or affect end game playing.
Yeah it's very obvious that players loves freebies but personally for me as a server admin, i really hate giving out any kind of freebies because they should learn how to make their own items. And isn't hunting one of the cool things you could do on playing RO (cause for me it is)? Get motivated, hunt your stuff and get strong (though there's lots of reasons to get motivated). And generally speaking we're talking about private servers here where
most items are easy to get besides official server rates.
And also, like Nitrate said:
Quote from: Nitrate on Jun 15, 2015, 01:09 AM
server owners are trying to bait players by these stupid freebies
I could say another reason why admins are just giving away OP stuff.
Freebies are popular because most of the guys who have been playing RO for 8+ years can't honestly be f*** to start from 0 every single time. I hate freebies as well, so I don't give 'em out with the exception of noob leveling gear to get a fresh guy started. I think excessive freebies or "Ready to PvP/WoE" s*** breeds casual gamers and s*** PvPers.
Official "freebies" already exist, namely Eden Group gear, preceded by Novice Grounds stuff.
Both are default in renewal but could be adapted for pre-renewal as well, which would be a better solution than just outright giving free gear.
Servers that want to make a quick buck, it also has to do with the target audience RO attracts, and well they love freebies.
Go look at any RO server facebook/social media pages and see how many "Ano po freebies dito?" "is there freebies here?" "Freebies???????" you see. Heh, boils down to bad admins and a toxic playerbase overall.
Quote from: Irreverence on Jun 17, 2015, 08:37 AM
I think excessive freebies or "Ready to PvP/WoE" s*** breeds casual gamers and s*** PvPers.
Lol this, and once they lost the PVP they gonna go quit and say GM is being a bias lol.
Quote from: Terpsichore on Jun 17, 2015, 09:45 AM
Official "freebies" already exist, namely Eden Group gear, preceded by Novice Grounds stuff.
Both are default in renewal but could be adapted for pre-renewal as well, which would be a better solution than just outright giving free gear.
It's official server after all besides, i think the eden group gear is not really a big deal (unless they give free god items lol)
Quote from: Turtle on Jun 17, 2015, 10:05 AM
Servers that want to make a quick buck, it also has to do with the target audience RO attracts, and well they love freebies.
Go look at any RO server facebook/social media pages and see how many "Ano po freebies dito?" "is there freebies here?" "Freebies???????" you see. Heh, boils down to bad admins and a toxic playerbase overall.
Lol damn right, i'm waiting for a server to post that there isn't freebies in there and people should move their lazy crapness to make their own stuff.
It's lazy gaming, but there are two sides to it.
I get a decent amount of messages wondering about expanded donation lists, or what they can donate for privately. We don't accept 'em because pay2win is s***, but their reasoning is usually "I don't have the time to no-life this s***", so I can understand that. But I doubt that's the case with 90% of these casuals.
Just look at all the standard MMORPGs out there. You do Quest after Quest and your gear is always up to date because its a Questreward. You dont have to farm until you hit the level cap.
I'd say we got 3 types of people who want freebies:
1.) People who are new to RO dont know that its a grindy game and part of the fun to farm your stuff
2.) People who usually play higher rates and get everything instantly anyway
3.) People who are bored of server-hopping and dont want to farm the same items every 2 month and will leave soon anyway
Quote from: Duckshooter on Jun 25, 2015, 06:46 AM
1.) People who are new to RO dont know that its a grindy game and part of the fun to farm your stuff
2.) People who usually play higher rates and get everything instantly anyway
3.) People who are bored of server-hopping and dont want to farm the same items every 2 month and will leave soon anyway
In short, they're all just lazy.
Dunno about #1 tho but i think freebies ain't the answer to know the game, they should just learn the basics of the game instead.
RO playerbase is fickle as f*** nowadays but for good reason. They've switched servers so often, noone gives a crap anymore about grinding and whatnot.
People want their gears fast so they can woe, the only aspect anyone cares about anymore. That's why midrates are the only thing still alive these days (not really though). And though it might be that some people still find fun in warpsuraing MvPs or afking in BG for mats and whatnot, I suspect the bigger reason is that the majority aren't good enough for true woe servers and prefer to "stomp noobs" on new midrates, plus not actually having enough people for a full guild, thus needing random fillers.
Even midrates are a joke these days, it's funny watching them crash and burn after not even a month. As soon as the first woe starts all these newbreed woe guilds suddenly notice they only have 10 players and proceed to sudoku. Of course, there are some rare exceptions, for example I have no idea how woonRO manages to survive without a woe scene, it just does. And of course TalonRO but that's a unique case and anyone who plays there is likely a mentally retarded monkey (no hard feelings)
So anyway, everything just works off woe guilds coming and going. Admins know this. For all the aforementioned reasons, guilds want freebies. Admins have to budge because it's the only way to get population these days. therefore, freebies.
Sure there's still tons of "randoms" ie pugs on every server, but they don't make a server survive. Actually, it's pretty annoying watching their naivety "oh i totally believe this server will pull through!" when the admin is already considering pulling the plug while counting all his donation money.
As for why the community is so fickle, besides having done everything a million times, it's also bad experiences with GMs I guess. Most admins out there just want to rake in donation money, everyone knows this. So basically, when you know the server won't last long and the admins just want your money anyways, there's no reason not to be fickle. The only reason you're running into a "deathtrap" head-on is because you want to woe, right?
It's funny when people get upset over how "toxic" the woe community is when really they just don't give a f*** (ie dont need to fake politeness) because they can see right through admins fake s***. "abloobloo please appreciate our hard work" lol 'f*** outta here you cancer.
You can see how this is sort of a devils circle, its the community's fault that servers are so short lived, but garbage servers made the community like this in the first place.
Though recently some of these lowrates seem to have gained decent populations. I'm guessing they don't have freebies because they're lowrates, maybe i'm wrong.
Quote from: fugg:D:D on Jun 25, 2015, 04:09 PM
proceed to sudoku.
lol.
Quote from: fugg:D:D on Jun 25, 2015, 04:09 PM
Though recently some of these lowrates seem to have gained decent populations. I'm guessing they don't have freebies because they're lowrates, maybe i'm wrong.
Which ones?
talon and aeva
PS - Because Triper can edit.
I guess it's very rare to see a 255/100 RO with no freebies and has high population like dark-ro had before.
Since what fugg said was right:
Quote from: fugg:D:D on Jun 25, 2015, 04:09 PM
People want their gears fast so they can woe, the only aspect anyone cares about anymore.
I guess that's one of the very reason why players these days wants everything to be almost free, and at the same time admins also create an RO that's most are already free, specially overpowered donates.
Yo triper my post isn't racist, just factual, but ok.
Quote from: Mary Magdalene on Jun 25, 2015, 11:59 PM
I guess it's very rare to see a 255/100 RO with no freebies and has high population like dark-ro had before.
Since what fugg said was right:
I guess that's one of the very reason why players these days wants everything to be almost free, and at the same time admins also create an RO that's most are already free, specially overpowered donates.
Depends on what you consider a 'freebie'. I implemented a newbie equipment system quite some time ago that provides players with a weapon and armour at certain level benchmarks (albeit it only granted a small stat boost).
Quote from: Ewol on Jun 26, 2015, 09:09 AM
Yo triper my post isn't racist, just factual, but ok.
Psst, you know how people around here are. Better prevent than let it happen.
Yeah, you have a point.
As to stay on topic, other than the servers I mentioned I don't see many big ones. I don't think we'll see servers as big as the recent ggRO again or for a long time, but who knows. Perhaps we will see EternityROv4?
just search the taiwan/thailand scene granted youll probably lag hardcore if you dont live in sea but the servers over there are just about as huge as official when ro first came out
Quote from: Dazzu on Jun 26, 2015, 04:31 PM
Depends on what you consider a 'freebie'. I implemented a newbie equipment system quite some time ago that provides players with a weapon and armour at certain level benchmarks (albeit it only granted a small stat boost).
Well you're right, that's no big problem.
Freebies these days are just like Dark-RO's valkyrie set lol (Unfrozen, Stone curse and sleep resist and stats etc) which just destroys the game at all, then for sure there would be quest armors stronger than those kind of freebies, making it a total crap.
Quote from: Mary Magdalene on Jun 26, 2015, 11:36 PM
Well you're right, that's no big problem.
Freebies these days are just like Dark-RO's valkyrie set lol (Unfrozen, Stone curse and sleep resist and stats etc) which just destroys the game at all, then for sure there would be quest armors stronger than those kind of freebies, making it a total crap.
So I've read. I recall reading a thread somewhere here that some servers actually put overpowered (or at least comparable to end-game) equipment as "donations". It sounds more like micro transactions, ha. Anyways, back to topic.
Grossly entitled players will always demand freebies, but if you provide a stable income outlet, the more sensible players can take advantage of it. I've no idea why server owners would add a bunch of PvP/PvE ready equipment as 'freebies' unless they're running a SHR server. They either want to make a quick buck, attempt to reel in players with a high turnover rate, or they don't have an inkling on how to run a proper server in the first place.
Allow me to also quote some points dreamzky's post, since he made some statements that I would like to argue with.
Quote
1. New update
All pserver almost the same. No new mobs. The different is renewal and pre-renewal only. There is no totally new update. Like from pre-renewal to renewal (although that renewal totally messed up /heh), but that also make me want to play it more. Even other games, waht u want the most is new update content. Not just some remake new town, skill balancing (damn, it important also!), or same mobs with new colour.
I can't speak for other server owners out there, but the cost of commissioning a credited spriter/mapper is no penny change. A single, custom mob commission has a base price of $60 (lowest I've seen) and adding exclusivity rights can cost them upwards of $100, same applies for 100% custom maps. Which is fair price considering the amount of work and required skills to produce such. This is no easy money since a single commission is sometimes done with a few mob and map orders. Servers who can't afford it will most likely be creative and try to incorporate already existing mobs into their ideas.
Quote
I really want mvp that easy to kill while in party (Not too easy like in renewal, normal atk also can kill it), and also can be solo but much harder and take longer time to kill (Not too hard, 1 hit kill, atleast can tank it. I think it can be achieved if mvp deals dmg based on %hp).
The MvP system is supposed to be tackled by a sizable party, and even then it should pose a good challenge. However, with SHR, High, and even mid rate server, the stat caps makes it possible for one person to solo MvPs. Buffing MvPs are sometimes missed by pserver devs, admittedly it's something I should be doing to my server's MvPs.
Quote
Each account also should be limit on mvp. Why the f*** same ppl keep killing mvp non-stop just because he/she more stronger than others? Thats 1 more reason why ppl keep change to new pserver just to conquer it. Myb they can kill it, but make item from mvp lootable 1 time only by that same ppl. Mvp will spawn back if item doesnt being loot. It giv more chance for other ppl to kill it.
A monopoly is sometimes necessary to create competition. Allow that type of system and you'll effectively kill competition and it becomes a game of reverse hot potato. Not really a good idea for a server that promotes a competitive environment. I do, however, have an issue with the MvP system where the person who dealt the most damage to it gets the loot and can relate to your statement where stronger players literally have control over MvPs.
I would like to also play devil's advocate and try to reason how freebies can be a good thing to a certain extent. Freebies could be a way of starting off a new player (assuming we're in pre-re, otherwise Eden Quest) instead of throwing them out in the world and leave to figure out stuff on their own. It's also a legitimate method of attracting and possibly permanently acquiring new players, so long as the freebies are far from end-game quality. Freebies should not be a constant measure and its content is highly dependent on the server's nature. If the server's low rate (99/70), freebies should be very minimal(potions, exp boost, etc). No idea about mid rate lol. High Rate is finicky as well. Basic leveling gear (ie. anything better than cotton shirt/knife) may be essential to a PvP-based server, since players may spend a lot of their time grinding for equipment rather than experience. PvE or RP-based servers may not include leveling gears.
Quote from: Dazzu on Jun 27, 2015, 01:40 AM
I can't speak for other server owners out there, but the cost of commissioning a credited spriter/mapper is no penny change. A single, custom mob commission has a base price of $60 (lowest I've seen) and adding exclusivity rights can cost them upwards of $100, same applies for 100% custom maps. Which is fair price considering the amount of work and required skills to produce such. This is no easy money since a single commission is sometimes done with a few mob and map orders. Servers who can't afford it will most likely be creative and try to incorporate already existing mobs into their ideas.
That is actually quite cheap, real stuff for real games cost a lot more. Yes, 99.9% of the servers out there are jokes.
Quote from: Dazzu on Jun 27, 2015, 01:40 AM
I can't speak for other server owners out there, but the cost of commissioning a credited spriter/mapper is no penny change. A single, custom mob commission has a base price of $60 (lowest I've seen) and adding exclusivity rights can cost them upwards of $100, same applies for 100% custom maps. Which is fair price considering the amount of work and required skills to produce such. This is no easy money since a single commission is sometimes done with a few mob and map orders. Servers who can't afford it will most likely be creative and try to incorporate already existing mobs into their ideas.
Or more likely a
creative admin can just try and learn how to do all of those him/herself, i even approve that one.
Additionally, they'll even learn from it.
EDIT: But nvm, who would do that these days tho (probably a very very few)? Most servers now are all about money and bull s. Because RO servers these days are not all about having a creativity side now, it's all about how much freebies and OP donates it has.
I guess I underestimated the costs, it's a lot more expensive than I previously seen.
As someone who tried to create a full scale map from scratch with no prior experience, it takes a lot of time and dedication on top of your server priorities. I reckon spriting is a lot harder than mapping. Unless owners choose to neglect their rl priorities, they will have to hire someone to do it for them.
(my server is essentially a tf2 hat simulator because of all the donation hats, lmao)
Players that play RO these days are ridiculous. You must offer guild packages and s*** like that, or they wont play your server.
It's all about 'whats for free?'. They don't care about if the server is good or not as long as they get freaking freebies.
You say that like it's the players fault.
Why should I care anymore to much about any server, they all either wipe/close or get screwed over by inactivity/market inflation/corruption... what do these GM's do then? they start a brand new server
At least I wont give to much of a s*** if a mid rate server shuts down, I didn't invest months/years and grind hours each day for NOTHING.
Quote from: SpaceFalcon on Aug 13, 2015, 04:20 PM
You say that like it's the players fault.
Why should I care anymore to much about any server, they all either wipe/close or get screwed over by inactivity/market inflation/corruption... what do these GM's do then? they start a brand new server
At least I wont give to much of a s*** if a mid rate server shuts down, I didn't invest months/years and grind hours each day for NOTHING.
It really doesn't matter who's at fault but lemme ask you, what's the point of running a server without any players playing?
And also, how will you convince players these days to play on your server?
If i was the player, starting with even a simple knife and cotton shirts will be very enough for me, but what about the MOST players these days? ' ready to pvp freebies ' and ' guild package ' bull s***? And if the GM did not gave them those what's gonna happen next? The player will say
' this RO server sucks because they dont have what i want ' and hop to a new server or simply they're just gonna leave.
But of course I'll also quit once i knew the GM was a bias idiot, not because of his/her efforts on trying to build a community
Quote from: Mary Magdalene on Aug 13, 2015, 11:27 PM
It really doesn't matter who's at fault but lemme ask you, what's the point of running a server without any players playing?
And also, how will you convince players these days to play on your server?
If i was the player, starting with even a simple knife and cotton shirts will be very enough for me, but what about the MOST players these days? ' ready to pvp freebies ' and ' guild package ' bull s***? And if the GM did not gave them those what's gonna happen next? The player will say ' this RO server sucks because they dont have what i want ' and hop to a new server or simply they're just gonna leave.
But of course I'll also quit once i knew the GM was a bias idiot, not because of his/her efforts on trying to build a community
Your argument is a double edged sword, because there is a very specific point to running a server even if no players join it, and this must be clearly established before you can understand why there is none. The two things are complimentary, and cannot live without the other.
I have been working on my ragnarok project for months now, starting from the summer of last year. I only opened my server february for beta testing and spent all time prior completely on my own in the server, working on things. After beta I closed it back down to work on it some more, reopening recently in July and spending all of the time in between alone. Now that I'm open, I still have not seen many players on my server as of yet, but I also have not been sitting there expecting people to join just for the sake of having people join my server. It is true: I do what I do for the people.
You could say that there is no point in working on any project if you are not going to give it to others, especially if you are aware of your own capabilities.This, however, is only the result of the reason I set out to create this project: I wanted to make a good game. Change the game, fix the mundane flaws that the original game had. I wanted to make a good game, but I wanted to do it for the people. Make a good game, for the people. Get it? There is a component that requires you to have no people involved for you to do it anyways, and the component that requires people to be involved for what you doing to have a point. I require a grand total of 0 players on my server to make the game better, and there is no problem with that. Ragnarok hyperbolic time chamber training, if you will. Not having people on my server isn't a deciding factor in me wanting to make a good game, but gives me a reason to do so other than just to say "haha i made the best game ever". The same could be said about anything in life: any ability or thing, no matter how grand, is useless and pointless if you only have it for the sake of having it. The sadness of the situation comes when you finally make something great and have nobody to share it with.
As a last note, what keeps me playing a game is whether it's a good game or not. I thought this was established from the beginning of time, but it appears the human race is deteriorating considerably.
That being said, I don't expect much from a person who claimed I was alt clienting to advertise, so I don't expect anything to be uttered out of your mouth other than pure selfishness and ignorance. Impress me.
That is if you really just wanna create an RO like i did for the last 2 years and closed it after telling myself and realizing " why am i running this server anyway even without players? ". So i don't wanna be a somehow ' left-out ' person who's been playing with myself on that ghost town sitting and alt tabbing and trying to advertise. Unless you're some trained loner.
Anyway to be short i already lost motivation to continue it further because i don't see any fun at all anymore.
Oh and lemme tell you as well that I'm a solo admin like you and i gave everything i could to make it a ' good server ' for people to love it and to be enjoyed. How selfish am i right?
So i really dunno what are you fighting for atm, and i really don't remember where i told you were dual clienting to advertise.
Everything that i said on your quote was my past experiences as an admin, not only me but every admin who replied on this forum does. no one says it's the player's or GM's fault as well.
Anyway, no offense but if you still wanna continue to make your project a good server even if probably to be a dog to most lazy and idiot players who wants everything for free, then so be it, no one's stopping you lol, if that's what a good server means for you.
P.S
And i seriously don't have time to have a nonsense argument with you plus i seriously don't need to impress you over an argument that's just nothing but just really... nonsense :) And my rudeness? forgive me for it.
Quote from: Mary Magdalene on Aug 14, 2015, 03:26 PM
That is if you really just wanna create an RO like i did for the last 2 years and closed it after telling myself and realizing " why am i running this server anyway even without players? ". So i don't wanna be a somehow ' left-out ' person who's been playing with myself on that ghost town sitting and alt tabbing and trying to advertise. Unless you're some trained loner.
Anyway to be short i already lost motivation to continue it further because i don't see any fun at all anymore.
Oh and lemme tell you as well that I'm a solo admin like you and i gave everything i could to make it a ' good server ' for people to love it and to be enjoyed. How selfish am i right?
So i really dunno what are you fighting for atm, and i really don't remember where i told you were dual clienting to advertise.
Everything that i said on your quote was my past experiences as an admin, not only me but every admin who replied on this forum does. no one says it's the player's or GM's fault as well.
Anyway, no offense but if you still wanna continue to make your project a good server even if probably to be a dog to most lazy and idiot players who wants everything for free, then so be it, no one's stopping you lol, if that's what a good server means for you.
P.S
And i seriously don't have time to have a nonsense argument with you plus i seriously don't need to impress you over an argument that's just nothing but just really... nonsense :) And my rudeness? forgive me for it.
I find it fun to make cool new things about the game because it's a type of training that helps you understand how games work better and broadens your vision about all of the possibilities out there for grabs.
I would have to say though, RO has expired its interest for all the professional players of it many years ago. The last time I saw any players who knew what they were doing was over 6 years ago, and all the people who claim to be good are pure trash and have no clue what legends have existed before them. It's no surprise that RO servers have devolved to appease these incompetent masses by giving out gear and adding stupid broken things to their server when the game has been so stagnant and broken for so long. They are desperate to get attention and get people to continue playing the game. I have not seen a single server even attempt to solve the following problems on more than a superficial level:
- Class and skill balance(see below)
- Item balance(cards all do random things, gear is clearly favorable towards tanking even though the game is centered around kiting because of ridiculous monster damages in pvm)
- Monster balance(experience is stupid and random, monsters either are impossible to deal with or too easy)
- Mechanic balance(how the whole game is centered around kiting, both pvm and pvp, causing half the classes to be shut down)
The best you see is stupid donation headgears that give stats that kind of change how the game plays out but not really. Bard bragi is still retarded, professor's dispelling every 0.2 seconds is retarded, paladin devo gospel is retarded, creator ad is retarded, where you get items and why is still retarded, monsters make no sense and their exp is borderline random, the game has so many fundamental flaws nobody has ever even bothered looking at because scared of some unknown mystical force that I fail to comprehend.
Everyone always complains about how RO is old, RO always corrupt, nothing new ever happens. If someone put out a complete overhaul of Ragnarok that was way better than the original game but took all your cheap gimmicky strategies away, would you really be willing to try it? Would you really go there and happily learn something new to play a better game? Or would you just quit(or even worse, never try it) because it's not what you're used to, thinking about everything in terms of how it stands in the old game?
Can't do your same old dumb habits of a broken game? Better go back to garbageRO and complain about it on RMS some more.
On a side note, I guess it wasn't you then, I don't really remember.
All i could say now is every admin have their own style / ways of making their RO server to be a good server even if how messy / stupid it might be.
Maximum life span of RO these days? Could be 1 - 3 months because basically those admins are just aiming for one single goal, cha ching!
And only a few decided to make it live long and become a good server.
So this is why I've seen players complaining on a SHR server and I was /hmm Everything is so easy to farm, why complain /?
Servers should set the standard for the type of players they want to attract, for whatever motivation spurred them into existence, and if players choose to leave, well then, that's just part of the filtering process. Let them leave, and good riddance. Players hop around for servers, in search of what will satisfy them, it's natural. Eventually, they'd wise up to the fact that instant gratification is boring (and they'd be replaced by the next generation of lazy players /wah.)
What makes a server strong and enduring is the admin's conviction and dedication, if he knows what he stands for, the players he attracts will follow and support him. Sure, there will always be some (or more) toxic players, and hosts can't be paid with dokebi gold, but isn't that part of the challenge of running a server? The server is the reflection of the admin, what does your server say about you?
I personally think that by just giving Potions as freebies are fine. /ok
RO is such a niche game...so sad. I hope it can make a comeback one day like Counter Strike. I remember I was playing CS:Source and it felt like it was about to die. Stopped playing for a few years then found out at the start of this year that CS:Global Offensive made it hugely popular again.
Cause over a year ago none of my friends had played CS, maybe some had heard about it. Now, every kid and their uncle knows about CS. It's so massive. People get crazy amounts of YouTube views for a simple unpacking or whatever you call it.
It just takes one f*cking good idea and a focused group of awesome people. I still think there's a market for this game, just nobody knows what to do with it. And those who could do something with it are focused on other games and would see it as a waste of time.
Quote from: rubie123 on Aug 12, 2015, 09:37 AM
Players that play RO these days are ridiculous. You must offer guild packages and s*** like that, or they wont play your server.
It's all about 'whats for free?'.
Because a guild will join a server, half will quit. You have to realize half of woe players don't want to gear up because they do other s***. The worst thing for them is investing time and then having a s*** woe or no woe at all. It's not uncommon for an admin to do something stupid like change the woe time when it's perfectly fine. Three or four people can gear a whole guild but why should they put in all that effort or money?
Quote from: rubie123 on Aug 12, 2015, 09:37 AM
They don't care about if the server is good or not as long as they get freaking freebies.
You must be so proud being able to grind low rates, you think people really can't do that?...
Quote from: Blinzer on Aug 14, 2015, 04:16 PM
RO has expired its interest for all the professional players of it many years ago
There's a whole bunch of reasons, the game isn't the problem.
Quote from: Blinzer on Aug 14, 2015, 04:16 PM
The last time I saw any players who knew what they were doing was over 6 years ago
That's probably because you weren't playing the game.
Quote from: Blinzer on Aug 14, 2015, 04:16 PM
I have not seen a single server even attempt to solve the following problems on more than a superficial level:
.......
Maybe because most people never wanted it to change you idiot, most people wouldn't play that server, even if it was just out of belief that it wouldn't be popular.
Quote from: Blinzer on Aug 14, 2015, 04:16 PM
whole game is centered around kiting, both pvm and pvp
nope.
Quote from: Blinzer on Aug 14, 2015, 04:16 PM
broken game
I totally agree the game could be more fun, alterations would be nice. But it broked, your play doesn't matter
I will say the main reason new players don't join a new server is because of lacking party... there is openkore that could have solved the problem by creating auto bot party... but no.
The problem of RO dying is because admin don't invest on casual player. They expect player to join in and invest their time, regardless how hard it is. Grind is fine for long term player , but for casual players that is crap.
Making game content available from sheer luck is just stupid on low population. Who in his right mind will try to farm a vitata card on a 20 pop server. Then again people will drop rate increase, but it does increase the problem. You still need to grind to extract game content while leveling.
When I join S4 League, regardless of my gear, I can compet right away, rookie or pro can play together without waiting 2 months of leveling.
Suppose I am joining a server, get to lvlv 160 and now invite some others friend, hello... see you in 2 month when you are lvl 160 like me. This is stupid.
Same goes for WOE, a guild joining = wipeout the whole scene. Farming god item = wipeout² = gear up = wipeout^3. Then a new guild arrive, and get wipeout then quit.
Gear should play a far less factor and same goes for all skills.
If you are a casual player, you don't need a Vitata card.
Problem of smart donkey are generating those kind of answer... constantly trying to pick a good pose with retard thinking.
Dude, if 99% of game content isn't worth because I am a casual players then wtf is a point to have a game content in first place.
As of today, every body can download rathena or hercules and run a private server ... all I see are scammer that don't help rathena fixing bugs, nor hercules upgrading ...
You just downloaded an open project and brush your ego, but all in all, you aren't capable of redoing something new because rathena and hercules are for 99.99% admin a black box with tuning and scripting interface.
The whole SFX table has been decyphered, adding skills, adding jobs, adding costum .. all has been done and toolkited
After 15 years , game balance is still isn't understood, most people still think they should balance class instead of skill.
Skill need to be balanced between each others, so a fire bolt 1 should be equal to Comet lvl 5 or equal to fire bolt 10.
Gravity destroyed the game balance to force player to team up, but that shouldn't imply slavery between classes.
For a 5000 pop, it doesn't matter , slavery between classes is ok..
For a 100 pop, it start to kick in as a default behavior.
Then again, party should be not a wall for dungeon ... and database of players shouldn't even be split among different server.
For Servers on the SEA community:
Random pinoy makes server
copy pastes some pop template
Opens cash shop with p2w crap
advertises over other ro servers' groups on Facebook
opens
makes cash
starts thinking about the new server he'll make after this one dies
repeat forever
For servers in NA/EU:
all about nostalgia
classic trans
classic non trans
lots of features
server opens
woe happens, one side wins, the other side loses
losing side starts looking for a new server
winning side afks in town while looking for a new server
server closes
I look down at frequent GM events
@Nano
sums it, lel
@Nano
Yes, but not all. I am still proud that SolaceRO is not a cashcow server. LOL
Though to be honest, you got it right. A lot of servers go up and down which feeds the "server hopping" hobby of players.
@Nano
100% right heheheehe
Majority look for the Freebies and easy farming and rates i guess /heh don't think the servers need to give too many freebies... there should be progression.
Majority of the players today are looking for a classic low rate server with bunch of freebies and would request 4x experience and drop rate boost every weekend which totally defeats the purpose of playing in a low rate server. /wah
i came across to a server that has zero freebies except the rok on hat that provides 400hp that decreases 50hp per 10 levels that greatly helps new comers as a starting gear. well providing 4x exp every week end isn't bad at all and i don't see the point of it defeating the purpose of the server specification being low rate. id rather play on a low rate classic server with this kind of specs than playing to a low rate trans server that is closed for almost 1 month then suddenly will arise from nowhere begging for his players to come back by providing more freebies lewl so hypocrite. see this link for more details http://solaceragnarok.com/index/packages/ (http://solaceragnarok.com/index/packages/) /heh /gg
P.S. that starter package is the best fit for the word "it defeats the essence of a low rate server lol."
Well you really cant blame them because most people of "our" time have already grown up and have other priorities now. Other than that, younger generations are mostly influenced by these "MOBA" insta action themed games that are popular at these times. I do still believe that there are people who want to do it the old way. Grind for levels, items and do questing. Freebies are okay unless you plan to spoon feed people. :)
Quote from: PlayRagnaOnline on Feb 23, 2016, 06:15 PM
Well you really cant blame them because most people of "our" time have already grown up and have other priorities now. Other than that, younger generations are mostly influenced by these "MOBA" insta action themed games that are popular at these times. I do still believe that there are people who want to do it the old way. Grind for levels, items and do questing. Freebies are okay unless you plan to spoon feed people. :)
Ragnarok
is a MOBA. It's an RPG which plays like an FPS and has the level of strategy of a MOBA.
You're not going to get kids to play ragnarok without someone else showing it to them first. They won't find it on their own because the game is old and roficial is a disgrace, that's half the reason the game is declining.
Quote from: Blinzer on Feb 23, 2016, 09:39 PM
Ragnarok is a MOBA. It's an RPG which plays like an FPS and has the level of strategy of a MOBA.
You're not going to get kids to play ragnarok without someone else showing it to them first. They won't find it on their own because the game is old and roficial is a disgrace, that's half the reason the game is declining.
ragnarok is not a moba nor an fps game it's an mmorpg or massive multiplayer online role playing game mate.
Ragnarok Online (spelled Ragnarök in the logo; Korean: 라그나로크 온라인, alternatively subtitled The Final Destiny of the Gods), often referred to as RO, is a Korean
massive multiplayer online role-playing game or MMORPG created by GRAVITY Co., Ltd. based on the manhwa Ragnarok by Lee Myung-jin.
A first person shooter (FPS) is a genre of action video game that is played from the point of view of the protagonist. FPS games typically map the gamer's movements and provide a view of what an actual person would see and do in the game.
MOBA is a genre definition for multi-player games where not only two parties struggle for resources or attack/defend, but each party/person is against all others in a confined space, therefore the term arena .
i agree with the reasoning of that guy about moba games stealing the limelight on mmorpg games since dota emerge from scene i'm also playing it but i never decline to play ragnarok until now.
Quote from: kmart on Feb 24, 2016, 05:55 AM
ragnarok is not a moba nor an fps game it's an mmorpg or massive multiplayer online role playing game mate.
Ragnarok Online (spelled Ragnarök in the logo; Korean: 라그나로크 온라인, alternatively subtitled The Final Destiny of the Gods), often referred to as RO, is a Korean massive multiplayer online role-playing game or MMORPG created by GRAVITY Co., Ltd. based on the manhwa Ragnarok by Lee Myung-jin.
A first person shooter (FPS) is a genre of action video game that is played from the point of view of the protagonist. FPS games typically map the gamer's movements and provide a view of what an actual person would see and do in the game.
MOBA is a genre definition for multi-player games where not only two parties struggle for resources or attack/defend, but each party/person is against all others in a confined space, therefore the term arena .
i agree with the reasoning of that guy about moba games stealing the limelight on mmorpg games since dota emerge from scene i'm also playing it but i never decline to play ragnarok until now.
Sorry, I didn't read what you said, but you're wrong mate.
Quote from: Blinzer on Feb 24, 2016, 12:59 PM
Sorry, I didn't read what you said, but you're wrong mate.
please support your argument with basis. :)
Quote from: Neffletics on Feb 23, 2016, 05:59 AM
Majority of the players today are looking for a classic low rate server with bunch of freebies and would request 4x experience and drop rate boost every weekend which totally defeats the purpose of playing in a low rate server. /wah
Majority of idiots feel important saying crap like this... Players have no time to invest in s*** half assed server with half customization and zero thinking game engine.
RO mechanism is far from been changed by the like of you, you only leverage on effort from eathena and jathena. But when we look into your own desire to run a community, those comment hit hard.
In 10 years , only 4 people tried to bring something new for RO mechanism
Vanro ( Anarchy + new original skills )
Nyro ( Extreme customization )
Ragnatale ( skills detached from classes )
esperaiRO ( Create S4 League mod for RO )
All others just , install + run server and beg for money ( I even spotted admin without a C++ compiler )
Quote from: annaquin on Feb 24, 2016, 10:39 PM
Majority of idiots feel important saying crap like this... Players have no time to invest in s*** half assed server with half customization and zero thinking game engine.
RO mechanism is far from been changed by the like of you, you only leverage on effort from eathena and jathena. But when we look into your own desire to run a community, those comment hit hard.
In 10 years , only 4 people tried to bring something new for RO mechanism
Vanro ( Anarchy + new original skills )
Nyro ( Extreme customization )
Ragnatale ( skills detached from classes )
esperaiRO ( Create S4 League mod for RO )
All others just , install + run server and beg for money ( I even spotted admin without a C++ compiler )
Quote from: Neffletics on Feb 23, 2016, 05:59 AM
Majority of the players today are looking for a classic low rate server with bunch of freebies and would request 4x experience and drop rate boost every weekend which totally defeats the purpose of playing in a low rate server. /wah
well the guy who made the post above is happened to be a huge failure as a gm of his own server. after he lose all of his players in his server he started to bash, ddso'ing and hating on other servers that has the limelight now a days and servers with decent population.
It's indeed a high occurences... installing and playing a server is way too easy and that's thanks from lua progress.
But all of sudden, when you look back in time, we didn't know lua would be that's great. Redoing a Server engine today would be more like a lua + C module, rather than a C engine with lua embedded.