Regarding RO Work, Graphics, Maps, Sprites, etc...

[kinzoku]

Since there's been quite a bit of commotion around with who owns what custom sprites, maps, etc... It seems there needs to be a way to handle this.
Impossible? Probably.

As of now there actually has not been really any cases of stolen sprites or maps, etc... There have probably been a few but very little as far as right now. As for ideas those are simply impossible to protect sadly.

Some of you may know that Ragnarok is starting to get more and more customized as Browedit went public and spriting and stuff has developed a bit more perhaps there should be a way to start protecting these before it does get out of hand.

My suggestion would be for either RMS or someone to create some kind of gallery of these sprites/maps. People could send in their sprites/maps etc.. to RMS before it is released either based on solo artists or as a server whole. They would send in a screen shot of it and perhaps some kind of proof that they made it, sometimes even a website with the author and everything. Then it just becomes a gallery based on that with people's art that is to remain theirs. So if another server steals it the original creators could perhaps show their work in this gallery claiming it is theirs and the other server could either be removed, suspended or ask for the custom thing to be removed from their server.

It seems a bit of a challenge but it would really be worth it for all the hard work that is put in to most of these arts.

Obviously there are some drawbacks like people who try to put two of the same thing in under a different name, someone who tries to steal and submit something first, or people trying to claim the famous "Blue Valkyrie" as their own. There would have to be some kind of system to this.

I just came up with the idea perhaps others should contribute to make this thing perfect.

Most of you probably know that it would be possible to get a creative commons license but that doesn't help at all because it allows others to distribute the work as long as credits are provided. Which a lot of us do not want.

Just something to be discussed I hope it could be implemented.

Thanks for reading,
Kinz

[A92FL0163]

I like the idea of it, I just hope, if this is ever implemented, does not make RMS look like a second RUNE.  

[kinzoku]

it might look like it but the files are not for download just proof of the author and/or server owning the work.

[Hutchy]

I think that will just increase the number of copyright arguments that pop up. D:

While it would be nice to have a directory showcasing custom sprites so people don't have to sift through the horror that is RUNE, how would we really tell who made what?

[LemonCrosswalk]

I don't think there is an issue with people saying I CREATED THAT!!!!!!!! It's more, I took it from ____ and I am going to use it so f*** you and there is nothing you can do to stop me.

[kinzoku]

That's the truth to it. A lot of people have their work stolen that wasn't released to the public. kind of like how there's no point in using creative commons because it's just telling everyone they can use your work. Which obviously is not what any of them want because they never released it to the public.

[Hutchy]

I still have yet to see someone successfully take legal action over it..

[SilverStream~]

I sued someone for stealing my SilverStreamGraphics name and using it for his own site selling artwork his friend made using some 3d program and paintings.
I registered it before him, I trademarked it before him. I made the website mine before him so it's ~Mine.

I didn't have to pay anything either because the guy lost.  Took.. a few weeks~months.  Can't remember.


If you have a clear case, it doesn't cost much, and you're really just making the other person look bad and possibly paying for something that is un-necessary, because that person could just do a search first and have it clear what names one can use.


But mostly taking legal actions sucks and it just takes alot of time.  Mine was fast because well, my lawyer is my cousin :3 And he helps me with my legal stuff anyways so it was no hassle.

Normaly you wouldn't sue, but if the person is really stubborn and basicly stupid, you go legal on his donkey.  Plus it makes you feel good afterwards.

[yC]

I thought Usako and her website was best for it since she knew what she is doing and has a reputation in the RO graphic/sprite area.  Aren't they coming back?

I don't want to consider the possibility of taking the job of her site at this point because her site isn't dead .. or is it?

[LemonCrosswalk]

People who made the graphic can show proof of them making it and the files building it and crap, along with the time stamp of WHEN it was created. No one yet has said they claimed it. They just say that they got it, they don't care, and they're going to use it.

[A92FL0163]

I thought Usako and her website was best for it since she knew what she is doing and has a reputation in the RO graphic/sprite area.  Aren't they coming back?

I don't want to consider the possibility of taking the job of her site at this point because her site isn't dead .. or is it?

Usako RUNE is awesome, but most posts done there are with the point of being able to download something of the site and rarely any worth post is done.

Just put the gallery with linkings to RUNE website.

[kinzoku]

This is true but it's painstakingly hard to have anyone remove work from their website. If it's just a sprite or a map you can't exactly sue them for it. Rune is technically more for downloading rather than seemingly "protect" files. I guess this is quite a bit of a challenge and nothing much can be done about it. Still, I feel like people don't even care about stealing work anymore. Since it was "impossible" a lot of people just think. "They stole the work, nothing you can do about it since RO is stolen anyways." Which is understood but it's like they just have no care for it or even want to try to do anything about it.

[Aire]

So this means that Delusion's also stealing your s***? lol

[kinzoku]

Not yet or hopefully not. Lol.

[Annihilate]

Lets call the offender OffenderRO, and the victim victimRO

(I ripped this off from one of my posts in another thread. The same things apply anyway, so I just modified it a little.)

As far as I know, eAthena and all its software is freeware under a GNU public license agreement. This means that everything that is/was/will be derived from it should be under the same agreement too. Customs from that old server being copied by offenderRO is actually ok, and they cannot get penalised for that.

GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE
Version 2, June 1991


....

2. You may modify your copy or copies of the Program or any portion
of it, thus forming a work based on the Program, and copy and
distribute such modifications or work under the terms of Section 1
above, provided that you also meet all of these conditions:

   a) You must cause the modified files to carry prominent notices
   stating that you changed the files and the date of any change.

   b) You must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in
   whole or in part contains or is derived from the Program or any
   part thereof, to be licensed as a whole at no charge to all third
   parties under the terms of this License.

....


(Source: http://svn.eathena.ws/svn/ea/trunk/LICENCE)

Under the GNU, offenderRO by default has the licence to use the content. So as far as I can see, you can even move heaven and earth to prove that offenderRO did "use" victimRO's content, but with the following mitigating circumstances:

1. Even if offenderRO did it, they have the right to.
2. Even if it was unethical, its still within the bounds of eAthena's licence.
3. OffenderRO's reputation for originality may become tarnished, but they cannot be punished for this particular act alone.


The Bottomline:

1. eAthena is freeware. we were able to enjoy RO without paying for licences. It is then also our responsibility to contribute to the community by following the terms of use of the server software.

2. Corollarily, Intellectual property(software,sprites, custom items, custom maps, love letters, promo shirts et. Al. whose development can be linked to the use of eAthena ) rights do not hold in the same manner as patent for, say a new brand of Coke. OffenderRO did not [knowingly or unknowingly] break the law.

3. Read contracts. They are there for a purpose.

4. Well using the content is ok. But claiming it as their own is not.That is something wrong.


But if offenderRO says "We have customs like [insert list of rip-offs]" in their website then it is ok. It becomes wrong though if they say "We have original custom stuff like [insert list of rip-offs]" or "We wrote/made/drew [insert list of rip-offs] for use in our server"

The point to be proven here is the intent of offenderRO to not recognize victimRO's authorship [read: authorship and ownership in this particular discussion are 2 different concepts].

Wording is tricky, but sometimes, having to do some semantic nitpicking is necessary to maintain objectivity.

But yeah, if claim it as their own, I will help any grievanced party with plucking the eyes out of them bad people. Lol.

5. Originality is good but getting around general public concessions is not the way to do it. The offenderRO's players should decide for themselves if this rip-off is good enough we have no right to do the thinking for them.

6. Have you ever asked yourself why gravity isnt suing private servers even if we are clear rip offs from the original game? The GNU. Thats why. If people wish to protect their minds' creations from use by people they dont like, then they'd better build the whole thing from ground up and get a patent.

7. To intentionally make one's work[that falls under the quoted clauses] unreachable to the public is another breach of the GNU. Tbh, developers should even put the source code in it and not just the compiled material.

8. That "copyright commission" thing is a good idea, but it violates a pre-existing contract. [ok, guess which :/ ]

9. "ZOMG but i didnt know whatthehell that GNU was when i made the custom stuff!" - Not my fault.

10. I do not own any server or even plan to have one. I just know what I have gotten myself into.




*back to sleep*