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RateMyServer.Net => Server Reviews => Topic started by: Reyl on Dec 21, 2008, 03:46 AM

Title: FeelRO
Post by: Reyl on Dec 21, 2008, 03:46 AM
I felt like the character limit was just a bit too constricting for my review, so I decided to post in more detail here. I'm also surprised that FeelRO has seen so few other full reviews when they're ranked so highly in the standard list. May as well put this section to better use.

QuotePros: Few crashes/minimal downtime, large population inflated by autotrade vendors, solid economy. Cons: Always laggy for US, from mildly irritating to unplayable. I was KSed fairly frequently, and people aren't very friendly to strangers. I saw 1 or 2 events. GMs are nice, but usually hard to reach or unable to be of much use.

Rating: 55
Server - Stability: 7, Availability: 9
Community - Friendliness: 2, Eventfulness: 3
Game Masters - Friendliness: 9, Availability: 2, Helpfulness: 3
Game-play - Economy: 8, Guild Competition: 6, Class Balance: 6

As some background, I joined the server about three months ago, rebuilding remnants of my guild that had run across nearly a dozen servers together for nearly three years. I disbanded the guild over a year ago in hopes of achieving something even greater: I began working together with Tira to build EssenceRO and focused my attention on managing issues with in-game enforcement, class balance/gameplay improvements, and forum moderation. I resigned after about 9 months because I was expecting to be very busy in real life, but I finally found some time to spend on games again several months later. I'm not sure if I'll join the Essence staff team again anytime soon; I personally feel that unless you're willing to commit your time fully to your job, the results you get are going to be less than your best. I only began to work on Essence because I very sincerely wanted to make it the best server that I could. And as someone who still enjoys playing games, I, perhaps selfishly, decided that I'd rather play than dedicate that time to administration again. So I gathered up some old (and new) friends, and took a look at the next best RMS ranked server: FeelRO. I was curious why this server has expanded to a 1500+ population in just under a year.

About the server host itself, it's fairly stable, but I do remember a few server hiccups where players would lag out (get stuck in a lag spike that simply disconnects them from the server). I could usually log back in right after though, which means that the server availability is higher than the stability. Over the past few months, I can't remember if there were any genuine incidents that kicked everyone out other than a few scheduled downtimes. However, the worst issue was definitely the lag for North America. It ranges from mildly irritating (you can play, but you feel a noticeable delay after every click and button press) to almost unplayable (you click and wait for several seconds only to discover that you're already dead). I couldn't find a pattern to the lag variability either, since it seems to intensify at random times of day for hours at a time. One night at 11pm would be awful until 2am, then the next night would be much better. This also applied for many of my guildmates, who mostly play from North America. Since there's no section in the scoring for lag though, I've marked the server's stability as above average (7) the availability as exceptional (9).

As for the community, I'm a little bit surprised. My initial impression from FeelRO's reviews was that the server was filled with friendly, open-minded people that are welcoming to new players. The rules are strict and are written clearly enough to leave little room for negotiation; they even finish with a "Don't be stupid" rule. However, I was a bit disappointed to find that this is not the case, especially as you level progressively higher and people become increasingly more possessive of their bits of online data.
For instance, I leveled my Assassin Cross in Juperos 1, grimtoothing Venatus for experience and zeny for several hours a day and weeks at a time. The rules specify clearly that if a monster is either attacking or being targeted by another player, then it is not fair game to take it from that player. However, it was very common for other SinXes to sweep dangerously close to my mob as its chasing me, or hide nearby and grimtooth the mob I'm already grimtoothing actively. The unfortunate fact is that it's hard to catch these KSers in the act: you're already busy keeping a mob in tight formation, compensating for the half second of delay from server lag, and they're cloaking or hiding most of the time. Moving your cursor across them without a Maya Purple or Horong Card is challenging, and landing a screenshot on top of that is almost unreasonable. Even if you do secure evidence, it's difficult to reach a GM anyway, a point which I'll cover later.
I leveled my Clown and High Priest in parties at Abbey Dungeon 1-3. Most of the time, when people are trying to arrange a party there, they grab anyone they can find that fits their party's needs. But as a result, you find people who have differing opinions on the most efficient characters and skills to use for leveling there, or people who tend to slack off for a free ride on EXP. I was impressed: for a gathering of people trying to achieve the same goal, they can find all sorts of reasons to bicker amongst each other, blaming each other for any failures the team may have experienced. It's a surprisingly volatile environment despite the fact that its intention is to strongly promote teamwork and allow people to meet each other.
But if fighting against monsters breeds this kind of hostility, then what about fighting against fellow players? You guessed it; it's even worse. I'll never understand the logic behind bullying newbies, but it applies to FeelRO as much as, if not more so than, any other server. Anything that discourages a player from having fun on the server adds to the chance that they'll leave the server. Still, you'll find unprovoked gangbanging and burst EDP-logout runs to be fairly common in PvP, especially if nobody knows who you are. To them, you are just meat for them to cut down; if you're not tough enough to take it, then don't come in until you are. Okay sure, though that's the kind of logic I'd expect to see on a high rate PK server. Maybe I'm overly chivalrous, but I don't like fighting people who clearly don't want to fight me, possibly because they're not strong enough face me, they're too busy dueling someone else, or they just want to watch how other people fight. It doesn't bother me much, but I can see some players leaving the PvP room and deciding it's not worth ever coming back into again.
And maybe it's just me, but it's hard to talk to other players in general. There might have been a language barrier, but it felt to me as if most of these players just don't like wasting their time with strangers. And if you read the forums, every WoE ends with an "analysis" thread that eventually culminates in 10+ pages of flaming. I can confidently say that the friendliness of the players did not leave a very positive impression upon me, which led to a score of 2.

I can't speak much for the eventfulness, since I didn't witness very many in the past three months. Once, I saw that one was already running when I logged in. The only other one I recall was a "Town Hall event" run by a few of the new Support GMs. This was apparently an occasion for the GMs to answer any questions that the players might have. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that what a Support GM is supposed to do at any time they are logged in? For organization purposes, they blocked their PMs and answered the first question that caught their eye in the standard chat. They were able to answer some trivial questions, but there were many questions for which their only response was: "I'll ask the rest of the team later and get back to you on it." Obviously, given the format and the number of GM-starved players, the whole process took a very long time. Since this is about the only event I was able to witness firsthand, I was not impressed and scored this category as a 3. I should note that while Endless Tower (as a scripted event) is alright, I feel that the credit belongs to the developers on eAthena for scripting it, not the server staff for taking it and sticking it in.

This already overlaps a bit into the GMs themselves. As far as I've seen, they are definitely very friendly, patient individuals. I haven't seen any statements that come out inappropriately or any cases where they fail to maintain a strong sense of professionalism. My complaint, however, is that they're extremely difficult to reach. With every KS I had to put up with (which was quite often), @whogm showed up with no results. I had to post several times on forum in a public thread before I received any attention until I made a public thread. Even when they did respond, they only answered one of my two questions and ignored the other. After PMing them repeatedly, I finally got an answer to the second question. Likewise, the only GMs I've ever seen in-game are the Support GMs who ran the Town Hall event in the previous paragraph. Yes, they were friendly and patient, but again, they were not very useful. Though this doesn't affect my characters directly, I've also noticed a large number of AFK homunculus users on the server, which is against FeelRO's rules. Maybe all of them are actually there and able to respond to a GM when one shows up. But then I would question why there are so many players using a homunculus to hunt like that. Maybe the GM team is not lazy about catching these players, but since I can't even report KSers to them in-game, my intuition tells me that they probably are. A 9 for friendliness, but 2 for availability and 3 for helpfulness.

In my opinion, the economy is fairly strong. Player population ranges from 1000 to 1500, but I would estimate that about half of them are vendors. It might inflate the population, but it also means that you can usually buy anything you need with zeny - assuming you can make the money to afford it. Grinding for a few hours in Juperos 1 or Gefenia is usually enough to handle most non-boss, non-miniboss items on the market, which can sometimes be faster than hunting the item itself. Donation equips are sold for zeny, but this took me about a week of money grinding to complete for one character. Miniboss and MVP cards are on a higher tier of expense, but still purchasable with zeny; I think Maya Purple/Phreeoni/Stormy Knight sell for around 275m and Tao Gunka sold at 1b. Ironically, with the server's custom settings on boss drop rates (3x drops but 30x for card while non-boss drops are 25x), you'll find that stuff like Glove of Orleans (+2 DEX slotted accessory) is worth more to players than most MVP cards. It's a strange economy, but I think it's pretty good if I'd rather grind 2m-3m zeny than hunt a non-boss card at 25x drop rate. I scored this as 8.

Guild competition here is... unusual. Although FeelRO has a few custom changes that improve survival, they do very little to balance offense in return. It's also tough figuring out what FeelRO modified because they don't make a list of changes for its players, but some key points I've noticed are that:
When you add the standard WoE penalties on damage to these changes, you find that it's absurdly difficult to kill people. There's a video of a single Lord Knight equipped with full Demihuman resistance gear tanking an entire guild for nearly 15 minutes, making it far enough to hit the emperium with his Combat Knife for a while. Obviously, it makes it pretty discouraging to defend a castle when you're not sure if you can kill the players before they break past your traps and smash your emperium; as a result, the trend I've noticed for most WoEs is that castles tend to change hands very quickly. Now check the number castles for each WoE. For the four main WoEs that are placed at the same time Monday, Wednesday, Friday, and Sunday, you have 2 castles available. For the additional American timezone WoE, there is only 1 castle available. In other words, for a server that hits 1600-1700 during WoE time, you have everybody piling into the same castles. I've been developing strategies for WoE for a few years, but my best recommendation for this server is to make a guild of 20 EDP SinX (or maybe dedicated Star Gladiators with Hatred and Warmth) and rush the emperium in the last 3 minutes of WoE. The defense will simply be too hard-pressed fighting off other guilds to stop all of your emp breakers. Still, in terms of competition, the server is not bad. You'll find that every WoE attracts many guilds, each with 10-25 players at once. Some are far older than others and have much better equipment than newer ones, but are still unable to securely hold a castle because their numbers and alliances are not sufficient to hold off the rest of the server. You can take castles here as long as you have the basic equipment, the numbers to slip past other guilds busily fighting amongst each other, and plenty of potions to spam. Guild competition is above average with a 6, but falls short a higher score because only the last 5 minutes seem to matter in this zerg rush of emp breakers and other players who mistakenly believe that they're making a difference. Class balance is about the same, slightly above average at 6 because of the few adjustments they've made. If you consider RO classes to normally be balanced, then try to picture it where it's harder to kill everyone. I'm not sure if you can call this balance, but any class that usually focuses on damage may be in for a disappointment.

That came out a lot longer than I expected, so if you've read this in its entirety, I apologize for wasting so much of your time XD. In any case, I'm about the only member of my guild still logging into this server, so it's time for me to go as well. I'm still not sure why this server has so many players, but my guess is that its a stable server that targets the European population when most servers compete for the Americas. It's not a terrible server by any means, but for much of my guild, it just isn't very fun.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: BomberWill on Dec 23, 2008, 02:43 AM
Too long of a review to read but I did read the guild competition section. Are other skills nerfed, like Asura Strike/Guillotine Fist? You said that AD was nerfed, but does it seem like such a huge nerf? Regular AD is 50% reducted against demi-humans from most servers. A 15% headgear reduct is pretty brutal, the server I play in only has a 10% headgear reduct but also has other reducts which most of the WoE player owns these days.

It seems you have a lot of competition in WoE and 4 WoEs a week is awesome. How many people WoE on average?
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: John Locke on Dec 23, 2008, 12:35 PM
My opinion:

1) its the only mid rate out there keeping the RO basic sistem. ( 99/70 ) (apart from MicRo and forgotnameRO)
1.1) mid rates > low rates.
As a example of this a friends guild just joined a new server (valiantro) instead of joining the best low rate server (eternityRO) because its boring to play 1 month or more to start making some competition for the stablished guilds on a server that is already "old" and u never know how long more will it last.
1.2)any guild can join and get theirself ready for WoE in 1 week and start having fun there.


2) It does focus for european and american population, it does NOT lag almost (only a bit position lag)
2.1) Focus for european and american population means 1 GOOD woe time for both areas: this is the server main WoE: sunday at 19:00 GMT +0. (the weekdays woes can be funny but arent really good)

3) It does respect the top 200 vote site as it deserves, having a coin sistem to be on its top almost always, what indeed keeps bringing new players all the time. ( Both newbies and Veterans )


It also have bad things in my opinion:
1)like custom drop rates for some important items. (buffalo horn, and a long etc)

2)the drop rate for mvp and miniboss cards is absurd.(x30).The amount of gostring cards is absurd. As well as the aviability of MVP cards. (champs and high wizards wearing orc hero cards, but this is a lot less common than Gostring cards)

3) It has some weird fixes: EDP is 5/6 as powerfull as it should and AD is 10% weaker. Yet not enough nerf to screw them. Suposed to be to compensate high aviability of both items.




SO its the best mid rate out there, thats why its so popular. Simply and plain. (even if its not perfect at all and has some weird stuffs)
And yeah, I do play there.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Rudolph Zyaber on Dec 23, 2008, 05:17 PM
QuoteSO its the best mid rate out there, thats why its so popular. Simply and plain. (even if its not perfect at all and has some weird stuffs)
And yeah, I do play there.

Being the best Mid-rate out there is a matter of Opinion.  I played FeelRO myself for a short time to see what it was like and I made pretty much all the same observations as Reyl did only in a shorter amount of time.  And after reading Reyls review, a lot of my assumptions about the server seem to be true as well.

I don't think it's a bad server but I'm personally not a fan of any server that gives any sort of Advantage to players who forked over money to the server.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Xarale on Jan 19, 2009, 06:26 AM
I reviewed this server a little while back.  I have to say, it's by no means the perfect server, but it's still a decent one, one that I made very good memories with.

The server still mostly attracts EU players, you'll often see various german/french/russian chat whilst in towns/PvP.  Despite that though, there is still many US/CA/English-speaking players on the server.  However since my review, they have actually added a single WoE time now for US players, which may encourage more US/CA players to join. 

The community isn't as friendly as it once was, but it's still not too bad.  Hell, I still randomly chat to people in towns/pvp, though I have to admit that not many people are as chatty in towns these days.  Still, I'd talk to you if you randomly saw me running around Pront/Ostia. (my ign is Halo)

I also agree regarding the donation items.  Although they're not really that strong, they do give a slight advantage over non-donators.  However, all donation items can be traded/sold by players for zeny, which allows even non-donators to get their hands on donation items.  The only trouble with this is that donators can make some easy zeny through buying & selling donor items, pretty much allowing them to gear themselves up without having to hunt at all.

I've pretty much left FeelRO now though as most of my close friends have moved on.  I just mostly come on to visit the remaining friends/members of my guild.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Smuggles on Jan 20, 2009, 10:49 AM
I've played on this server since March and I really like it.
The only thing is that I get along better with american players than European players even though I'm Swedish/Spanish. The timezone difference is quite a hassle though and I miss loads of friends but hmm...I have quite alot of american friends on the server and they play without lag all the time =)

I miss the whole "I'm 99, I'm special" thing, since its pretty easy to level up on FeelRO if you know how, even if you don't have money. The community is okay...but most of the people either already have friends or aren't looking to make any. There are also an incredible amount of elitist german and russian players which makes it kinda difficult...I'm in the strongest WoE guild on the server but I have fun even though the competition is really low...Simply cause I took a year break from WoE.

I played iRO for about 4 years though so the whole feeling of leveling is pretty much taken away cause its too simple, on the community part I have to agree I have lost many friends as most have left because they don't WoE and the GM's don't hold ANY events, (I've been in 4 ;o;)
But I've tried other random servers and I just don't know where to go...I like lowrates but everytime I go on one most people are already 99 and have pimped out gear.

I want a big friendly community and fun WoE's/PvP and lots of friends, so far FeelRO is the only server that is able to give me that - I encourage people to try it out.

Also, if you ever need help leveling or just want to talk to someone and make a friend, these are the characters I'm usually on:

E. Rigby
Josh Homme

Looking forward to hearing from someone!

[Edit] Oh I read that people wanted more info on the WoE, its pretty cool but our guild basically fights vs another big guild called 100500, besides that the competition is pretty low and we could use some people that KNOW what they're doing to come fight and have some fun openfield battles >__<

&& the buffed MvP's are awesome, the lack of donation-like wings is amazing, I hate glittery shiny stupid looking things >< And the donation gears aren't that overpowered, they are the best but you can beat someone with donations - no problem! Money doesn't buy skill or experience.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: John Locke on Apr 05, 2009, 09:41 AM
Since I posted sooner to defend the server now im posting with my new thinkings about server.

Althought all i said sooner ( 23 dic u can read up) is yet true theres new things to consider when joining this server.

1) It reached high quality WoEs and it started to lag for some months, since lag started population started to fall, seems very clear that admin has no intention to upgrade server, even if he gets good donations.

2) The battleground items are implemented, also spiritual tunic. So, gameplay very affected, specially because spiritual tunic. (Tao gunka devotions, gostrings and devilings didnt seem enough overpower for admin).

3) Ridiculous lack of respect on players opinion about anything.

4) AFK-alchemist based economy until 2 weeks ago. Now theres one of those "write this or get banned" pop ups when u play with your homun. High quality stuff for sure. ( sarcasm )


And thats it, just with the first stuff its enough for me to be mad with this admin, he had a great server but f*** it up with his greed.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Xarale on Apr 09, 2009, 11:52 PM
Quote from: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.

It was revealed within the last couple of days that a few images from the "awesome" FeelRO website/login screen were actually taken from a dA artist without their permission.  Not only this, but these images were edited, and had the signature of the original artist removed from them.  More info from this thread on their forum.  -> http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I have to agree with some of the points made by John Jocke too.  The community has changed a lot since my original review last year, it's much more hostile these days when compared to last year.  Still, FeelRO is one of the better servers I've played on, and I'll most likely still visit it here & there while I look for a new mid-rate server.

Edit: Definitely agree with the forum bit.  It's annoying to have to register for an RO forum, just to get a glance at the community/server information.  The fact that FeelRO doesn't force you to register to view it is a plus.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 06:41 AM
Quote from: Xarale on Apr 09, 2009, 11:52 PM
Quote from: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.

It was revealed within the last couple of days that a few images from the "awesome" FeelRO website/login screen were actually taken from a dA artist without their permission.  Not only this, but these images were edited, and had the signature of the original artist removed from them.  More info from this thread on their forum.  -> http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I have to agree with some of the points made by John Jocke too.  The community has changed a lot since my original review last year, it's much more hostile these days when compared to last year.  Still, FeelRO is one of the better servers I've played on, and I'll most likely still visit it here & there while I look for a new mid-rate server.

Edit: Definitely agree with the forum bit.  It's annoying to have to register for an RO forum, just to get a glance at the community/server information.  The fact that FeelRO doesn't force you to register to view it is a plus.

Hi. I'm the artist from DA. Never thought it would come up here. I've had A LOT of experience with RO servers, both international, local and private. Cant say much about the ingame experience but I can say a few things about the GMs and the community.

Other than their GMs stealing my art, editing it and claiming it as hers, I found a lot of rude people on the server but yeah there are those nice respectful players. From what I notice the server seems like a standard not very well taken care of server (and if you were playing on the server I am now, you would understand more.) The community really is not as friendly as it seems. Too many disrespectful players. And sadly GMs and moderators tolerate this on their forums.

FeelRO creative teams (GM Alara) are not so creative after all using stolen art, the GMs are hardly ever on to respond to the players and so many people told me that they (regretfully) donated money and never recieved what was due. Furthermore, people are waiting for event prizes dating all the way back to december and it is now april. So sad.

I think the major weakness in this is server is its lack of care from the GMs themselves.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 08:56 AM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 06:41 AM
Quote from: Xarale on Apr 09, 2009, 11:52 PM
Quote from: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.

It was revealed within the last couple of days that a few images from the "awesome" FeelRO website/login screen were actually taken from a dA artist without their permission.  Not only this, but these images were edited, and had the signature of the original artist removed from them.  More info from this thread on their forum.  -> http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I have to agree with some of the points made by John Jocke too.  The community has changed a lot since my original review last year, it's much more hostile these days when compared to last year.  Still, FeelRO is one of the better servers I've played on, and I'll most likely still visit it here & there while I look for a new mid-rate server.

Edit: Definitely agree with the forum bit.  It's annoying to have to register for an RO forum, just to get a glance at the community/server information.  The fact that FeelRO doesn't force you to register to view it is a plus.

Hi. I'm the artist from DA. Never thought it would come up here. I've had A LOT of experience with RO servers, both international, local and private. Cant say much about the ingame experience but I can say a few things about the GMs and the community.

Other than their GMs stealing my art, editing it and claiming it as hers, I found a lot of rude people on the server but yeah there are those nice respectful players. From what I notice the server seems like a standard not very well taken care of server (and if you were playing on the server I am now, you would understand more.) The community really is not as friendly as it seems. Too many disrespectful players. And sadly GMs and moderators tolerate this on their forums.

FeelRO creative teams (GM Alara) are not so creative after all using stolen art, the GMs are hardly ever on to respond to the players and so many people told me that they (regretfully) donated money and never recieved what was due. Furthermore, people are waiting for event prizes dating all the way back to december and it is now april. So sad.

I think the major weakness in this is server is its lack of care from the GMs themselves.

Now your gonna qq here aswell? The gms never claimed it was their artwork the website framedesign they claim.

Furthermore only 2 different images used. And 2 on the website at a part thats never used and 1 on the character making part. So its not that the whole server is stolen which you claim. Neither were the signatures removed.

I vote ip range bann here too.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 09:00 AM
Quote from: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 08:56 AM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 06:41 AM
Quote from: Xarale on Apr 09, 2009, 11:52 PM
Quote from: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.

It was revealed within the last couple of days that a few images from the "awesome" FeelRO website/login screen were actually taken from a dA artist without their permission.  Not only this, but these images were edited, and had the signature of the original artist removed from them.  More info from this thread on their forum.  -> http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I have to agree with some of the points made by John Jocke too.  The community has changed a lot since my original review last year, it's much more hostile these days when compared to last year.  Still, FeelRO is one of the better servers I've played on, and I'll most likely still visit it here & there while I look for a new mid-rate server.

Edit: Definitely agree with the forum bit.  It's annoying to have to register for an RO forum, just to get a glance at the community/server information.  The fact that FeelRO doesn't force you to register to view it is a plus.

Hi. I'm the artist from DA. Never thought it would come up here. I've had A LOT of experience with RO servers, both international, local and private. Cant say much about the ingame experience but I can say a few things about the GMs and the community.

Other than their GMs stealing my art, editing it and claiming it as hers, I found a lot of rude people on the server but yeah there are those nice respectful players. From what I notice the server seems like a standard not very well taken care of server (and if you were playing on the server I am now, you would understand more.) The community really is not as friendly as it seems. Too many disrespectful players. And sadly GMs and moderators tolerate this on their forums.

FeelRO creative teams (GM Alara) are not so creative after all using stolen art, the GMs are hardly ever on to respond to the players and so many people told me that they (regretfully) donated money and never recieved what was due. Furthermore, people are waiting for event prizes dating all the way back to december and it is now april. So sad.

I think the major weakness in this is server is its lack of care from the GMs themselves.

Now your gonna qq here aswell? The gms never claimed it was their artwork the website framedesign they claim.

Furthermore only 2 different images used. And 2 on the website at a part thats never used and 1 on the character making part. So its not that the whole server is stolen which you claim. Neither were the signatures removed.

I vote ip range bann here too.


If she made it, and the gm team used it without asking her then it's stealing.

For example, the picture in your signature tag, did you ask the author for permission to use it?

No.



It's common nowadays to steal art, but if someone comes and actually is the owner you have to respect that. There are copyright laws specifically for artwork. She can sue them for taking her art without her permission.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:19 AM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 09:00 AM
Quote from: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 08:56 AM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 06:41 AM
Quote from: Xarale on Apr 09, 2009, 11:52 PM
Quote from: Broken Moon on Apr 09, 2009, 07:05 PM
One of the first things I saw when I went there was a midgear that gives +3 Dex being sold at the market (even though it was something around 50m).
I uninstalled it. :(
Their website looks awesome though, the same thing can be said for the forums (and they don't force you to register, that's a very nice plus). The tons of custom palettes, custom login skin and something else I probably forgot are great too.

It was revealed within the last couple of days that a few images from the "awesome" FeelRO website/login screen were actually taken from a dA artist without their permission.  Not only this, but these images were edited, and had the signature of the original artist removed from them.  More info from this thread on their forum.  -> http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I have to agree with some of the points made by John Jocke too.  The community has changed a lot since my original review last year, it's much more hostile these days when compared to last year.  Still, FeelRO is one of the better servers I've played on, and I'll most likely still visit it here & there while I look for a new mid-rate server.

Edit: Definitely agree with the forum bit.  It's annoying to have to register for an RO forum, just to get a glance at the community/server information.  The fact that FeelRO doesn't force you to register to view it is a plus.

Hi. I'm the artist from DA. Never thought it would come up here. I've had A LOT of experience with RO servers, both international, local and private. Cant say much about the ingame experience but I can say a few things about the GMs and the community.

Other than their GMs stealing my art, editing it and claiming it as hers, I found a lot of rude people on the server but yeah there are those nice respectful players. From what I notice the server seems like a standard not very well taken care of server (and if you were playing on the server I am now, you would understand more.) The community really is not as friendly as it seems. Too many disrespectful players. And sadly GMs and moderators tolerate this on their forums.

FeelRO creative teams (GM Alara) are not so creative after all using stolen art, the GMs are hardly ever on to respond to the players and so many people told me that they (regretfully) donated money and never recieved what was due. Furthermore, people are waiting for event prizes dating all the way back to december and it is now april. So sad.

I think the major weakness in this is server is its lack of care from the GMs themselves.

Now your gonna qq here aswell? The gms never claimed it was their artwork the website framedesign they claim.

Furthermore only 2 different images used. And 2 on the website at a part thats never used and 1 on the character making part. So its not that the whole server is stolen which you claim. Neither were the signatures removed.

I vote ip range bann here too.


If she made it, and the gm team used it without asking her then it's stealing.

For example, the picture in your signature tag, did you ask the author for permission to use it?

No.



It's common nowadays to steal art, but if someone comes and actually is the owner you have to respect that. There are copyright laws specifically for artwork. She can sue them for taking her art without her permission.

I asked them to remove it and I would leave their server alone. But instead they try to make things up trying to make it seem as if they had all the right to take my art from DeviantArt. They didn't just use it, it was edited, signatures were removed so I told them to find other works to use as I am already tired of seeing people who can't be original make bad edits of my work. Its a matter of respect however the GM still hasn't taken action and their members are continuously being rude to me on their forums. They call my art meaningless yet refuse to remove it as a part of their layout. :)
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:32 AM
agreed BUT on the stalker image was no signature. You also edited your first post so your arguments wont go invalid(on feelro). The stalker wasnt signatured.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:38 AM
Quote from: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:32 AM
agreed BUT on the stalker image was no signature. You also edited your first post so your arguments wont go invalid(on feelro). The stalker wasnt signatured.

The second image was. And like i said, your server admitted to taking my images from DA. And DeviantArt rules states images not in stock cannot be used without the artists permission. Stop acting like you actually know whats right from wrong. KKthx. :)
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 09:51 AM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:38 AM
Quote from: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:32 AM
agreed BUT on the stalker image was no signature. You also edited your first post so your arguments wont go invalid(on feelro). The stalker wasnt signatured.

The second image was. And like i said, your server admitted to taking my images from DA. And DeviantArt rules states images not in stock cannot be used without the artists permission. Stop acting like you actually know whats right from wrong. KKthx. :)

I think it's good that you push this, afterall if you made it you have to right to protect it.



Quote from: Toztie on Apr 10, 2009, 09:08 AM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 09:05 AM
In russia international laws still rule.


Shut your face and stop spamming.

lol this is harresment

There is no such things as international laws lolz. if russia or china doent want to do stuff they just dont. Thats called fail of nato.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_law
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright


Copyright is international.



And no, this is not harassment. Learn your facts please.



Edit; added another link.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 11:22 AM
If we can all stop being morons for a second, let's use common sense and facts rather than opinion.

1) FeelRO stole art from Chexie without her permission.
2) ..Oh, there isn't a number 2. Number 1 is enough to suffice, so why should there be?

If Chexie created the artwork, and did not mention that it was available for public use, yet FeelRO decided to use, and even manipulate the artwork, it is clear that FeelRO is in the wrong. If FeelRO is truly that deeply in love with Chexie's artistic abilities, they're lucky they she accepts commissions, no? And with all the donations that they likely receive, I'm sure they have money to request such commissions. It'd sure make them look a lot less like the faggots they're looking like at the moment.

Now, don't get me wrong. I don't like Chexie, and I don't particularly like publicization of "private" work. But if the artist chooses not to publicly release something that they created for public use, the least morons could do is act like civil human beings. Thus, there should be no need for copyright discussion.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 11:37 AM
Quote from: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 11:22 AM
If we can all stop being morons for a second, let's use common sense and facts rather than opinion.

1) FeelRO stole art from Chexie without her permission.
2) ..Oh, there isn't a number 2. Number 1 is enough to suffice, so why should there be?

If Chexie created the artwork, and did not mention that it was available for public use, yet FeelRO decided to use, and even manipulate the artwork, it is clear that FeelRO is in the wrong. If FeelRO is truly that deeply in love with Chexie's artistic abilities, they're lucky they she accepts commissions, no? And with all the donations that they likely receive, I'm sure they have money to request such commissions. It'd sure make them look a lot less like the faggots they're looking like at the moment.

Now, don't get me wrong. I don't like Chexie, and I don't particularly like publicization of "private" work. But if the artist chooses not to publicly release something that they created for public use, the least morons could do is act like civil human beings. Thus, there should be no need for copyright discussion.


You're right. The GM's of FeelRO should contact Chexie and discuss wether they simply remove whatever they took and edited, or if they should remove it, and pay Chexie to make them something.


One a lighter note; @Toztie, you seem to know very little about laws around the world. Don't try and make yourself sound smarter then what you really are. It just makes you more stupid.

Wikipedia is place where you can add information regarding different things. But they have strict rules and moderators who work there. Everything you post up there is checked for it's content, and legitimacy. The copyright laws, international laws and all other laws that exist and have been put on wikipedia are correct.
International laws are laws made so that certain standards are maintained and agreements between countries are held.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 01:54 PM
She kind of went off after a response from the head GM, and started bringing this all over the place before the matter was settled. Then demanded respect from the GMs over at Feel. And the whole time this was happening, the head GM was (supposedly) discussing the matter with the designer for FeelRO so they could come to an agreement and do something about the situation. x_x
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 02:03 PM
Quote from: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 01:54 PM
She kind of went off after a response from the head GM, and started bringing this all over the place before the matter was settled. Then demanded respect from the GMs over at Feel. And the whole time this was happening, the head GM was (supposedly) discussing the matter with the designer for FeelRO so they could come to an agreement and do something about the situation. x_x

Are you a GM, or something? If so, then get it resolved. If not, not sure why you've posted what I've quoted. It shouldn't require any communication with Chexie to remedy the problem. She's obviously not happy about her artwork being used without her permission, yet the art still remains. Whatever response she received from the "Head GM" over at FeelRO was likely not offering a very helpful resolution. They should respect her at least to the point that they will remove her artwork. After all, FeelRO, I'm sure there's plenty of other unsuspecting Ragnarok Online fan artists you can successfully steal art from for a few months before they realize it.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 02:06 PM
Quote from: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 01:54 PM
She kind of went off after a response from the head GM, and started bringing this all over the place before the matter was settled. Then demanded respect from the GMs over at Feel. And the whole time this was happening, the head GM was (supposedly) discussing the matter with the designer for FeelRO so they could come to an agreement and do something about the situation. x_x

I kind of remember 20 people cursing me out when i had posted a very nice reasonable thread to have it removed and your server owner simply said it was ok to use my art from DA and bans me. If they had just said they would remove my art and kept it private by replying to the email i wrote instead of allowing people to harass me and continuously be rude to me on forums and simply reply there maybe things wouldnt be out of hand.

FYI your members PM me admitting Alara steals sprites and claims she makes them and they are the ones who started to bring it up here. So im not surprised. overall you have a very disrespectful team. No offense. Your GMs and moderators just brought it upon yourselves for insulting me saying i had no right to have my art removed from their site instead of acting like the bigger person doing so. :)

Allowing members to curse me out, insult me as well as the moderators on their site doing the same thing, I really don't think anyone would have acted differently. If your GM wanted to resolve it properly he would just remove my art when i emailed him the first time instead of replying to my email with a link to his post on the forums defending their "designers" actions.

Furthermore if you keep insulting my art on your site saying "its not even good" then remove it. Its not so hard to remove an image on a webpage. :)
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 02:08 PM
The problem was being remedied. I've been following the topic over in feel, and the head GM made a post stating that he was trying to resolve the issue with the designer. He offered her a compromise, they discussed it, and he went to try to come to an agreement with the designer. This is what I've read from the topic. He offered to give her credit, and she requested her art be removed instead, so he had to go to the designer.
I'm not sure what's being done, but considering it was discussed with the designer, I think they might be removing the art.

@Chex: They very well may be removing your art. I dunno. I only posted what's been going on over there.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 02:11 PM
Quote from: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 02:08 PM
The problem was being remedied. I've been following the topic over in feel, and the head GM made a post stating that he was trying to resolve the issue with the designer. He offered her a compromise, they discussed it, and he went to try to come to an agreement with the designer. This is what I've read from the topic. He offered to give her credit, and she requested her art be removed instead, so he had to go to the designer.
I'm not sure what's being done, but considering it was discussed with the designer, I think they might be removing the art.

@Chex: They very well may be removing your art. I dunno. I only posted what's been going on over there.

No, the head GM as well as another GM never replied to me anymore and simply in simple words said they have no reason to remove my art and give me credit, so tell me why i cant get mad at that, and now they're trying to make it seem like they were resolving the issue. please. GM might kept defending his designer and simply they did not want it removed.

Now about respect, as you may have noticed my first post was very respectful and was asking nicely to have it removed. but really after 8 pages of a moderator allowing people to insult me and curse me out i think i have the right to get angry especially when a GM tolerates this behaviour.

i suggest we leave the issue before i bring up further issues about your designer based on PMs ive recieved from your own members telling me where she gets her "customs" from. This server is outdated as its designs and to be honest if your GMs wanted to resolve the issue they would say "ok, ill talk to alara" not leave me with a message like "you never signed it properly so she could use it" and link me to my own deviantart page then ban me for being angry at that. please. I am done discussing things properly with your moderators and GMs since all your members can do is type "**ing ip ban her." after im being respectful and your fellow moderator parttakes. so sad.

I will end with saying that server has a problem, if your own members tell me your GMs steal sprites, artworks and claim it as their own but they're too scared to mention it you really have a problem. I'm glad you choose to IP ban me and keep my artworks up. Have a little decency please. It's not too late :)

@GM Alara; learn how to be original, and dont claim copyright on art / sprites / custom sprites that aren't yours.

p.s. not directed to you antagonist
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Antagonist on Apr 10, 2009, 02:15 PM
Did you pm, or email?
Whoever other GM is might have logged off or something. x_x
Did you get to read the most recent post he made regarding it?
Either way, I hope an email gets sent saying what exactly happens. But since I'm (once again) only saying what's happening over there, I dunno what's gonna happen regarding the art, since that wasn't said.

Edit: Can you please stop using "your" like it's my server? I just play on it. It's not literally my server, and I'm not a GM. I don't want people thinking I am.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: bleu on Apr 10, 2009, 02:42 PM
hmm... i think it's best to create a new topic under Hall of Shame specifically about the stolen art incident at FeelRO. I believe that's how other cases were dealt with. I recall seeing another server with your chibi art being reported at that section not too long ago.

p/s: hope you get recognised for your creative works and your wishes as an artist respected. /ok
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 02:50 PM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 10, 2009, 02:42 PM
hmm... i think it's best to create a new topic under Hall of Shame specifically about the stolen art incident at FeelRO. I believe that's how other cases were dealt with. I recall seeing another server with your chibi art being reported at that section not too long ago.

p/s: hope you get recognised for your creative works and your wishes as an artist respected. /ok

No. Some threads were created here, or Server Reports, and moved there once confirmed to be performing immoral behavior.

But this isn't exactly off-topic. I wouldn't recommend starting a new thread. Perhaps the thread can be split into parts, if necessary.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: A92FL0163 on Apr 10, 2009, 03:19 PM
Shame most of feelRO community is just trying to avoid the matter, saying "ban her plx" or things like that, or just saying "lol internet is srs bussins" and variants of those. Awesome how the overall RO community is going downfall so fast. Not that it wasn't already going.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:40 PM
Quote from: MKR on Apr 10, 2009, 03:34 PM
You called a respected member of FeelRO's community a thief in public. Perhaps you're right legally, but the way you handled it was absolutely and objectively wrong. When you come to someone else's domain and start declaring your perceived rights in full view of the public and start making requests based on these interpretations, you can't expect them to be happy about it.

If I had inadvertently misappropriated someone else's work and that person were being disrespectful in their approach, I wouldn't even give them the time of day. Advertising EssenceRO by PM certainly didn't strengthen your position.

Perhaps you do have legal standing, but they know you probably won't take it to court, and even if you did, they probably have better lawyers. By handling it like you did, you likely eliminated any shot you had at getting them to do anything about it.

They stated way before i started talking to your members that they wouldn't remove it. So why bother? These people obviously have no idea how to respect artists rights. Your own members started PMing me so dont even bring that up. I'm disgusted at people who steal artworks, sprites and who knows what. Alara took it from DeviantARt with no credit at all. Stop acting like the GMs of your server are mature when they kept making reasons like I only posted warnings on my artworks 2 days ago. Please. They keep making stories and finding loopholes instead of addressing the problem properly.

GM Might should have addressed whatever he wanted in the email i sent him and after completely ignoring me and just posting on the forums that Alara didn't do anything wrong because she took my art from my DA page I doubt i have no reason to say these things.

Wake up. Your own members are the ones telling me how its such a common thing that Alara does and most of her custom sprites arent hers as your website claims.

Any server with any decent GM / Admins would respond properly to an email instead of saying "oh i dont see your watermark all over this image" and linking me back to my own website. Constantly saying excuses like "oh you probably never put a warning on it, you just did it 2 days ago coz we used your art. you prolly did that etc etc" Seriously the GM team needs to grow up. I really wouldve left the issue long ago if might replied properly to my email and dealt about the issue with me however being the so-called mature GM he is, he just keeps prolonging the flaming and obviously your mods and GMs say i have no right for it to be removed. its useless convincing people who are narrow minded.

Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:46 PM
Quote from: MKR on Apr 10, 2009, 03:43 PM
I don't know a thing about the GMs and don't care to. I'm talking about your manner. All the FeelRO community can see is you calling out Alara as a thief as being the start of this.

Because i had sufficient evidence that she consciously removes my signatures / watermarks. I already have proof that she knew where she was taking my art from and who made it. I understand you are defending your server but to be honest I had every right to do what i did. If GM Might removed it or told me he would instead of acting like the other 10 immature people posting there this would have been settled long before but their pride just keeps saying their right and they can use my art however they want.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:54 PM
Quote from: MKR on Apr 10, 2009, 03:50 PM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:46 PM
Quote from: MKR on Apr 10, 2009, 03:43 PM
I don't know a thing about the GMs and don't care to. I'm talking about your manner. All the FeelRO community can see is you calling out Alara as a thief as being the start of this.

Because i had sufficient evidence that she consciously removes my signatures / watermarks. I already have proof that she knew where she was taking my art from and who made it.

That's great, but it doesn't relate to what I'm saying at all.

Order of events from the community's perspective:
1: You call Alara out as a thief publicly
2: People badger you for it
3: You act silly

You can say you gave them plenty of advance notice, they can say you didn't, and neither means a thing.

re: Your edit.

What makes you think I'm defending anything? FeelRO could go poof tomorrow and I wouldn't care. I'm telling you why you got the reaction you got.

I don't really expect more from a bunch of no-lifers who like to spam as a hobby. :) No my so-called acting silly was merely a response to the GMs and mods defending her stealing my art. they really had nothing to prove she never stole it.

I am done talking to might and his team of GMs and their little art thief. I feel pity for her lack of originality and creativity. No matter what they say an art thief is still a thief and they really should've just taken my art down the first time to avoid trouble but i guess they like i that way. :)
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Navarion on Apr 10, 2009, 05:13 PM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:40 PM
Constantly saying excuses like "oh you probably never put a warning on it, you just did it 2 days ago coz we used your art. you prolly did that etc etc" Seriously the GM team needs to grow up.
You know, that you lost all the respect of the community? I mean, even this is just made up by you. It was not a GM who said something like this, it was a member. I guess, it's not so hard to seperate those two groups. You should definitely calm down.


Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 03:40 PM
Any server with any decent GM / Admins would respond properly to an email instead of saying "oh i dont see your watermark all over this image" and linking me back to my own website. 
I don't know if they would. Why did you make this public? I would have understood it, if you had been waiting for a response on a PRIVATE email for like one week. But, and the politeness of your post in feelro forums doesn't count, making such things public and insulting gm's is not the right way.

I know, that we have our super-dumb forum trolls, but why did you react on their insults? Everybody, who played some time on feelro, knows that it's best to ignore them. You just kept arguing over and over.

Tbh, I wanted to support you in the beginning, really. I also though it was reasonable, that you didn't want your artwork published on feelro's site, since you got insulted that much on the forums. But this throwing with mud, making bad advertisment and spreading it all over the places, without people really knowing the background, I just feel disgusted.
You want your art to be appreciated and not treated like dirt. How can art be great if the artist himself (or herself) went down to such a low level? For me art always represented the thoughts of the artist. I don't know about you. I mean, if you wouldn't be that immature, you would have waited what Alara is saying, or maybe asked for direct conversations ingame or on msn and not making threads on differents sites to hurt feelro. There are people who spend their money to help the server! With making the server bad (aww.. my English sucks) you hurt every player on it, who is having fun. Just check your first post here. It's kinda provocating -.-

Quote from: Chexie on Apr 10, 2009, 02:11 PM
No, the head GM as well as another GM never replied to me anymore and simply in simple words said they have no reason to remove my art and give me credit, so tell me why i cant get mad at that, and now they're trying to make it seem like they were resolving the issue. please. GM might kept defending his designer and simply they did not want it removed.

WTF?? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? Might (head gm) offered you to GIVE YOU CREDIT and you simply rejected (which I understand, mentioned above). BUT WHY ON EARTH DO YOU LIE NOW AND SAY HE NEVER OFFERED YOU CREDITS?? THIS MAKES ME REALLY UPSET

Trying to dragg some members to another server with blingbling stuff and 1000x custom headgears? Most people are playing feelro because there are NO cute wings, NO cute blabla gear and NO weird looking custom stuff.

In addition, feelro is changing a lot, since we got some new gms. One, GM Celestia, just re-opened a helper guild, with suitible players, who have some ro-experience. Some other stuff, mostly from GM Aerandil, i being implemented by Alara.

Giving a bad review and not mentioning, that the server is experiencing a change, is so damn low, that i can't even describe it with words. Like many others, who first supported you, I lost all of my respect.

So anybody who is interested in joining FeelRO and is concerned about this affair (which includes b**** about 3 pictures and a mudfight in the end, caused by stupid forum trolls and the artist) should read the WHOLE thread (http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667) editing the stealing words doesn't help. Expecially in such a discussion, editing doesn't help your legitimacy.

If you're wondering, why my emotions changed sometimes, I inserted parts and changed this post quite a few times.

But anyways, try not to sink far too low girl.. You're nearly on the ground anyways. I simply can't understand your intentions.. really
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Might_FeelRO on Apr 10, 2009, 06:31 PM
Hello, my name is Might and i am the founder of FeelRO. I assumed it would be fair if the story was told also from my point of view.

One day a thread called "Stolen Artwork on FeelRO" appeared in our forums. The author stated we used her art in our login screen layout and on the site and demanded those pictures to be taken off, since we had no permission to use them. I asked our designer (Alara) about the origin of those pictures. She said they came from some fan art site and since there were no signatures or watermarks on them - she used them as a part of the layout. (I must say the site as well as the login screen were created 1.5 years ago, so its no wonder she couldnt remember exactly where did those pictures come from.) So it appeared we had a problem. Willing to solve this nicely, in a way it would be good for everybody - i suggested that we create a Credits page on the site and put Chex's name in it. She refused. I decided to talk to Alara once again to work out some other solution, possibly - to remove those pictures. It took me about 3 or 4 hours - can't remember exactly - to reach Alara: she wasnt at home. When i came back to the topic to continue the discussion, i have found there a lot of things that stopped me from meeting Chex's wishes. Here i will give you some quotes from different resources.

First of all, I saw a lot of lies written by Chex in our forum. For example:

QuoteAlara actually edited the image, removed my signature and copyrighted it as hers

(http://i40.tinypic.com/208dum0.jpg)
This picture was taken from:
http://princesschex.deviantart.com/art/063007-Animated-Stalker-58760447
Wherem as you can clearly see there is no signature. And you won't find any Alara's copyrights on these pictures as well as anywhere on our website.

Secondly i found this journal entry, where our designer was obviously insulted. All these sentences were written before the discussion was ended. It was still in progress, but it didnt stop Chex from complaining at all possible resources she could find, calling us thieves, giving out our e-mails for other people to spam us, etc.

QuoteThis "designer" called GM Alara was editing my works
Lies.
QuoteI've just been informed they also use custom sprites that are not made by their designer however on the site it is stated she is the custom spriter and they defended saying she only does custom sprites and map. Now this. So sad. Seems to me like they really do promote art theft there.
Lies.
Quotethey say "IT TAKES SO MUCH TIME AND WORK TO CHANGE THOSE IMAGES"
Lies. Nobody among server administration never said such a thing.

And so on and son. Finally, i got messages from several players. It appeared that while i was holding talks with Alara trying to find a suitable solution to make both us and the author happy - Chex didnt waste her time, sending personal messages to our members, advertising her own server.

QuoteI noticed the GMs blocked the name of the server I'm from. Maybe to hide the fact that my art could be from there. i dunno. I noticed this server is very out to date, dunno if you have 3-1 classes and the GMs are never really on. Too many immature people on this server too. If you're interested in joining a server where GMs are on everyday and we have everything more advanced and where people give value to all RO artists with so many ongoing art contests i suggest you check out my server.I really laughed how very outdated this server is, I just wanted to offer you a server where you can rely on GMs, and this servers been on for 2 years or so?I'm pretty sure any player would like it. I used to play iRO and this was the first private server i'd ever consider

http://*******RO.com/ (http://*******ro.com/)

p.s. this is a server you wouldn't regret donating to. everything is under control and GMs really do well compared to here. i wont get any profit from this, just offering you a more respectable place to play.

i just feel bad for people playing here. so many rude people and GMs are never on.

After i saw that, she was immidiately ip-banned according to

FeelRO Forum Rules (http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=80)
(10. Do NOT make advertisement for other private servers, even in PM's! )
and
FeelRO Server Rules (http://www.feelro.net/Rules.aspx)
(Do not advertise other servers
Punishment for advertising is a permanent ban and an IP ban.)

And seeing this kind of attitude, taking into consideration that the author

...we decided not to meet the wishes of Chex.

Thank you for your attention.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 07:18 PM
Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 10, 2009, 06:31 PM

And so on and son. Finally, i got messages from several players. It appeared that while i was holding talks with Alara trying to find a suitable solution to make both us and the author happy - Chex didnt waste her time, sending personal messages to our members, advertising her own server.

QuoteI noticed the GMs blocked the name of the server I'm from. Maybe to hide the fact that my art could be from there. i dunno. I noticed this server is very out to date, dunno if you have 3-1 classes and the GMs are never really on. Too many immature people on this server too. If you're interested in joining a server where GMs are on everyday and we have everything more advanced and where people give value to all RO artists with so many ongoing art contests i suggest you check out my server.I really laughed how very outdated this server is, I just wanted to offer you a server where you can rely on GMs, and this servers been on for 2 years or so?I'm pretty sure any player would like it. I used to play iRO and this was the first private server i'd ever consider

http://*******RO.com/ (http://*******ro.com/)

p.s. this is a server you wouldn't regret donating to. everything is under control and GMs really do well compared to here. i wont get any profit from this, just offering you a more respectable place to play.

i just feel bad for people playing here. so many rude people and GMs are never on.

After i saw that, she was immidiately ip-banned according to

FeelRO Forum Rules (http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=80)
(10. Do NOT make advertisement for other private servers, even in PM's! )
and
FeelRO Server Rules (http://www.feelro.net/Rules.aspx)
(Do not advertise other servers
Punishment for advertising is a permanent ban and an IP ban.)

And seeing this kind of attitude, taking into consideration that the author

  • Insulted the GM
  • Told lies about the GM
  • Juggled with facts
  • Flamed us on different resources even before the discussion was over
  • Spammed our members with other server's advertisement

...we decided not to meet the wishes of Chex.

Thank you for your attention.

A screenshot of that PM would be AWESOME. No sarcasm intended.

Chex, if it's true that you attempted to advertise EssenceRO over some artwork, I just lost every ounce of respect for you. And believe me when I say that you had quite a bit in my eyes until this.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:34 PM
Wether she did all that or not;


She still holds the rights to that image/images which are in use by FeelRO.


This we can check by looking at the date which the image was posted on Chexie's DeviantArt account.
This is taken directly from here (http://princesschex.deviantart.com/art/063007-Animated-Stalker-58760447):

Details
Submitted: June 30, 2007



FeelRO is(according to their site):

1 year 3 months and 1 day.



I find no other recordings of this image that are earlier then what Chexie has her DA profile.



If she doesn't want her artwork on your site, and you have not asked her, or given her notice(which is basicly the same thing), you will have to take the image/images down.
She holds the copyright, you have not asked for her permission. Gm Might, you are doing something illegal and she calls you out on it you will have to react. And you do not do so by continuing to having those images on your site.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Might_FeelRO on Apr 10, 2009, 07:38 PM
Quote from: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 07:18 PM
A screenshot of that PM would be AWESOME. No sarcasm intended.

Chex, if it's true that you attempted to advertise EssenceRO over some artwork, I just lost every ounce of respect for you. And believe me when I say that you had quite a bit in my eyes until this.

http://i41.tinypic.com/2uqfxfr.jpg
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:44 PM
Also, this is taken from Copyclaim (http://www.copyclaim.com/protect.php)



"By entering the security code, you declare that you posses the copyrights for the file right now (related to the description above) and accept our privacy statement."





Did Alara posses the rights to the images she was about to copyright, or in the case of Might doing the copyright registration, were you aware that the image(s) were not rightfully yours?


When making such an entry like this in a public website where anyone can register anything, it is important to know that you must have and posses the rights to whatever your are about to register before you enter it.

Which means wether you try to register web designs, wallpapers, loading screens, sprites, or other stuff you need to own them before "copyrighting" them. The copyright registration is only a way of saying "Hi these are my pictures". It is not a way of claiming ownership.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 07:45 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:34 PM
Wether she did all that or not;
She still holds the rights to that image/images which are in use by FeelRO.


This we can check by looking at the date which the image was posted on Chexie's DeviantArt account.
This is taken directly from here (http://princesschex.deviantart.com/art/063007-Animated-Stalker-58760447):

Details
Submitted: June 30, 2007

FeelRO is(according to their site):

1 year 3 months and 1 day.

I find no other recordings of this image that are earlier then what Chexie has her DA profile.

If she doesn't want her artwork on your site, and you have not asked her, or given her notice(which is basicly the same thing), you will have to take the image/images down.
She holds the copyright, you have not asked for her permission. Gm Might, you are doing something illegal and she calls you out on it you will have to react. And you do not do so by continuing to having those images on your site.

Don't misunderstand me. I never said FeelRO was right. Nor am I siding with PrincessChex. Want to know why?

Because when you put things on the Internet, nine times out of ten, it WILL get stolen. It's a sad reality, but in the end, it is an equal fault. The only way to truly protect your art is to NOT POST IT.

Might, your server's staff is also in the wrong. Regardless of what condition her art was in(watermarked or not, signed or not), what happened shouldn't have. Nor can there be an argument when she CLEARLY HAS HER ART RIGHT THERE. A lot of drama can be avoided if you just take the goddamn things down.

Finally, PrincessChex herself. I have officially lost any ounce of respect I had for you and your work. What you did was sneaky and underhanded, and shows all the maturity of a five year old who doesn't get their way, and then attempted to direct their players to your server of choice, instead of being the bigger person and just focusing on resolving the issue, you have now lowered yourself to a status that equals that of the idiotic spammers you see in the "Hall of Shame". Good show.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:54 PM
Decent stop being a d***. Seriously.



On a lighter note; I didn't aim my post at your post, you posted before me and I didn't change what I posted. Didn't bother.


If this goes to the hall of shame it will be feelro and the gm team there that is in the spotlight. Chex did what she could as a "counter-offensive" because she was ignored, treated wrong and had something stolen from her.
To me it looks as though she must have been furious, and reacted thusly.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Might_FeelRO on Apr 10, 2009, 08:02 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:44 PM
Also, this is taken from Copyclaim (http://www.copyclaim.com/protect.php)
"By entering the security code, you declare that you posses the copyrights for the file right now (related to the description above) and accept our privacy statement."
Did Alara posses the rights to the images she was about to copyright, or in the case of Might doing the copyright registration, were you aware that the image(s) were not rightfully yours?
Copyclaim allows you to register anything partially. At copyclaim we registered only the items we made ourselves: custom donation gears, custom maps, custom images, etc. Everything that was actually made/painted by us personally. We didnt register every_picture_you_see_here or something like that. Nor we never said we didnt use fan art.

Quote from: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 07:45 PM
Might, your server's staff is also in the wrong. Regardless of what condition her art was in(watermarked or not, signed or not), what happened shouldn't have. Nor can there be an argument when she CLEARLY HAS HER ART RIGHT THERE. A lot of drama can be avoided if you just take the goddamn things down.
Alara had a fan art collection, probably like every artist does. She wouldnt go through stealing someone's pictures, if she'd knew they're copyrighted. Those pictures arent really that good. But those pictures were present in her collection, werent watermarked, werent signed, so she decided to use this fan art as a part of the layout. Then, after 1.5 years a person appears, who brakes every rule possible, insult us, lie and spread rumors about us, etc. And we need to be nice and meet her demands?
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 08:06 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 07:54 PM
Decent stop being a d***. Seriously.

I'm sorry, you are...? Oh, and it's Descent. There's an S. Please don't forget it.

Quote
On a lighter note; I didn't aim my post at your post, you posted before me and I didn't change what I posted. Didn't bother.

It seemed as such, which is why I said to not misunderstand me. I'm not taking sides on this issue.

QuoteIf this goes to the hall of shame it will be feelro and the gm team there that is in the spotlight. Chex did what she could as a "counter-offensive" because she was ignored, treated wrong and had something stolen from her.
To me it looks as though she must have been furious, and reacted thusly.

WHOA. Hit the brakes. So, by your logic, it's perfectly fine to advertise another server when you're mad.

That's pretty sh*tty. In fact, it's worse than that, but for the sake of "being nice", I won't elaborate.

I don't care how she was treated. She's not a 10 year old, she's actually close to my age. You'd expect her to react in a bit more mature of a manner, but nahhhhhhh.

Don't attempt to pull a pity party for her, by pulling that stunt on Feel's forums, she's now just as wrong as they are.

EDIT ---

Might, are you serious? This all could have been avoided, regardless of the pathetic hissy-fit she pulled as a result.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 08:30 PM
Might, every picture that is created, is automaticly and by the instant it is finished copyrighted the creator. It even says so in official copyright laws.

From both sides this could have been done in a better way. You when recieving the email from Chex could have asked for proof or whatever, and read the date it was created/uploaded on. That right there would have proved it.


Descent, I did not say that it was okay for her to advertise for her server like that. It does not say that in my post. I said that because of the way she was treated, she acted. Never said it was "perfectly fine". Read better next time please.
For who I am, I am a previous member here, and have been reading rms longer then you. You don't know who you're talking to, and you don't need to find out either. For me you are a new place to put my foot on.

I am not trying to "pull a pity party". I am stating what is right and what is wrong, no matter who the two parties are. It could be two completely different people and I would still post what I have posted. If you are going to post "I just lost all respect for you" etc and blablabla, then please don't. I have no interest in that.

If she decides to do things to the feelro site that is wrong according to their rules that is fine by me. But that is not illegal. The artwork stealing is however.









Final line, I say it's best that Might takes down the images until further talk. That is how it is normaly done. No loopholes and sidetracking. Take them down until you talk to Chex in an orderly fashion. Since this is online you can do you via msn, aim basicly any instant messaging client as it is like talking to a person face to face. Emails give both sides alot of time to figure out how to turn the opposing person's words around and try and talk your way out of it.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 08:34 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 08:30 PM
Descent, I did not say that it was okay for her to advertise for her server like that. It does not say that in my post. I said that because of the way she was treated, she acted. Never said it was "perfectly fine". Read better next time please.
For who I am, I am a previous member here, and have been reading rms longer then you. You don't know who you're talking to, and you don't need to find out either. For me you are a new place to put my foot on.

Rofl. Oh please, by all means, play with me. Just to warn you, I wouldn't step on me if I were you, I've been told I have sharp edges.

You seemed to imply that it was perfectly fine because she was the victim. Therefore, I called you on it. If you're going to tell me to read better next time, the same can go for you in proof-reading your posts instead of turning around and twisting it to better suit your argument.

I don't know who I'm talking to? Same could go for you, my dear.

Spoiler
That being said, kindly piss off, you donkey.
[close]

I honestly don't care what YOU have any interest in. To me, you're just a faceless nobody like 90% of RMS.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 08:37 PM
As I said:

Quote from: Symbiote on Apr 10, 2009, 11:22 AMNow, don't get me wrong. I don't like Chexie

And, her little attempt to advertise Essence only boosts that aspect. However, I still believe that her artwork should be removed. As well as her be permanently banned from FeelRO, seeing how she handled things. (Seems to have already occured, which is nice, however, the art does need to be removed if it hasn't already. Her idiocy doesn't change the fact that the server lacks the permission.)

I'd suggest Alara provide the website she claims to have found the edited works that she "stumbled upon" while "already edited." You have to realize that it's one person's word against another's accusations. Those aren't very good odds for either side, considering the lack of power Chexie has to find out otherwise, and the position that Alara is in. Potentially ruining your reputation, or lying? Hard choice!

Edit:

Also, if you stated that the art was taken from here (http://princesschex.deviantart.com/art/063007-Animated-Stalker-58760447) by Alara, wouldn't that mean that she had to have edited it? Which would mean this:

Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 10, 2009, 06:31 PM(http://i40.tinypic.com/208dum0.jpg)
This picture was taken from:
http://princesschex.deviantart.com/art/063007-Animated-Stalker-58760447
Wherem as you can clearly see there is no signature. And you won't find any Alara's copyrights on these pictures as well as anywhere on our website.

QuoteThis "designer" called GM Alara was editing my works
Lies.

is off, a bit? There's also a Copyright claim and a request not to use without permission in the image description. Not sure if Chexie just recently added that, as in after this thread was created, but it's there. Plain as day.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Descent on Apr 10, 2009, 08:39 PM
I'd also like to repeat one more time...

I AM NOT TAKING SIDES ON THIS.

Personally, if somebody were to ask me to remove artwork that I didn't know was from their site, I'd just do it and avoid the drama. Even though I think this "Instant Copyright" is sh*te and is pretty much being pulled out of somebody's backside.

Might, you might as well, as owner of the server, just do the right thing before this gets dragged on any further.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 08:47 PM
No if you make something(art), from your own head, your own creativity and your own hands; it is yours from the moment it is finished. Meaning you have copyright on whatever it is you made.

This does not apply if you have copied someone's work.




Example;

If you are at a convention and the crew leader asks you to make a vignette for your crew's stand. You would make the vignette and finish it as fast as you can. The moment you finish it, you hold copyright to that vignette.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Ayu on Apr 10, 2009, 09:34 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 10, 2009, 08:47 PM
No if you make something(art), from your own head, your own creativity and your own hands; it is yours from the moment it is finished. Meaning you have copyright on whatever it is you made.

This does not apply if you have copied someone's work.




Example;

If you are at a convention and the crew leader asks you to make a vignette for your crew's stand. You would make the vignette and finish it as fast as you can. The moment you finish it, you hold copyright to that vignette.



Sadly, when you are on the internet, there is one set of theoretical rules, and there's another set of practical rules as well. People argue using the theoretical rules, and act on the practical rules.

It's great if the server admins give the proper credit and all, but if they choose not to, there's very little that you can do about it, and not always does it worth the frustration either.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Xarale on Apr 10, 2009, 11:37 PM
I was originally siding with Chex on this one, but after today's events, I've pretty much lost respect for both sides.

I lost respect for FeelRO for using & editing artwork on your public website/client without the artist's permission, and for the hostile way the community reacted to Chex when she politely spoke up & asked the GMs to remove it.  Might, you cannot deny that Alara edited Chex's work.  You can clearly see she's recoloured some of Chex's designs, and used them on your website.  No matter how you look at it, you're using Chex's artwork without her permission.  Just do the right thing, and remove the artwork from your website/client, instead of being petty & keeping it there to spite her for advertising another server. (which I'll get into in the below paragraph)

I also lost respect for Chex for the way she fought back.  I can understand it's not easy when the majority of the community is arguing/insulting you when you're just trying to be polite/civil, but retaliating by advertising another server makes you look just as bad.  I personally thought at first that you'd personally PM'd me on the FeelRO forums in response to the friendly PM I sent you, where I was wishing you good luck with your case, but it seems you just spammed various PM boxes (including mine, twice) with this message: http://i41.tinypic.com/2uqfxfr.jpg
Thanks, but no thanks.

In summary, Might & Chex are as bad as each other.  You're both adults, so act like it.  I'm sure you can both come to some sort of solution if you talk it out.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Might_FeelRO on Apr 11, 2009, 03:20 AM
I had a talk with Alara and we decided we don't want to be any part of this any longer, especially since drawing something like Chex's art is something that can be done in a few hours without putting any supreme effort to it. We decided to take the mature side as long as nobody seems to be taking it and replace the images. I will provide you with a link in a couple of days. See you :)

P.S.
Chex,
We accidentally took your picture 1.5 years ago and used it on our site. We're setting it right.
You lied behind our backs, you juggled with facts, you are mean and silly. And there's nothing you can do about it.   
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Xarale on Apr 11, 2009, 03:30 AM
Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 11, 2009, 03:20 AM
I had a talk with Alara and we decided we don't want to be any part of this any longer, especially since drawing something like Chex's art is something that can be done in a few hours without putting any supreme effort to it. We decided to take the mature side as long as nobody seems to be taking it and replace the images. I will provide you with a link in a couple of days. See you :)

P.S.
Chex,
We accidentally took your picture 1.5 years ago and used it on our site. We're setting it right.
You lied behind our backs, you juggled with facts, you are mean and silly. And there's nothing you can do about it.   

That's good to hear, hopefully this whole situation will be resolved now. :D

/respect @ Might
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 11, 2009, 04:55 AM
Welcome to the internet where people are flaming F***s and dumb a**es because of anonymity.

If someone claims your artwork for their own, it's stealing. If someone uses your artwork for something else in a graphic and not profit from it, you can use it under copyright law as long as they site it. Other than that, people do not care. Nothing will happen to someone using an image unprotected on a site.

This isn't the first time an issue like this with your artwork being stolen. I gave you a lot of advice on how to protect your artwork and I have only seen one picture with a watermark. Yes, they are being irresponsible, lazy, and wrong for using your work, but you are being more so by not doing what you CAN to protect your artwork. Even your signature, which is the thing most often STOLEN, has no signature nor watermark on it. No copyright image on the bottom.

Be a professional. Go back and watermark your images. If you don't like watermarks, hide your signature within the picture. It is one thing to crop an image to use and a whole OTHER thing to actively erasing the artist's signature or symbol or whatever you use to show it is yours.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 11, 2009, 05:38 AM
Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 11, 2009, 03:20 AM
I had a talk with Alara and we decided we don't want to be any part of this any longer, especially since drawing something like Chex's art is something that can be done in a few hours without putting any supreme effort to it. We decided to take the mature side as long as nobody seems to be taking it and replace the images. I will provide you with a link in a couple of days. See you :)

P.S.
Chex,
We accidentally took your picture 1.5 years ago and used it on our site. We're setting it right.
You lied behind our backs, you juggled with facts, you are mean and silly. And there's nothing you can do about it.   

Big words for someone who kept claiming that my art had no right to be removed. That Alara had done nothing wrong in editing and using my art. After hours of defending Alara's actions as not being art theft which it was I'm finally glad you came to your senses. Or was it the emails that flooded your inbox from my fellow artists that bothered you? Stop acting like i advertised publicly on forums, your own members PMed me and after you and your staff deciding not to take down my images, promote flaming, cursing on me, and IP banning me i think you kinda deserved it. Not to mention that you could have avoided drama by simply keeping things between the both of us in email, did you not read where i wrote that i would no longer post on your forums if you decided to take it down? Was it so hard to do? After all you didn't like my art right? Yet you somehow just decide to start an argument on the forums with me, continuously allow your members to harass me where that is clear breaking of forum rules. I'm surprised a forum doesn't follow its own rules. "**** you b****", "****ing ip ban her", oh so much respect in that. You just waited to a point that you could make up something and make me look bad and twist the story. W/e.

Seriously I'm not hiding anything I did, you on the other hand along with your other co-GMs were soooo reluctant to let my art go, like it was making you money or something, deleting an img src code from your friggin webpage is easy as hell. A simple "yes we'll get rid of it" at the beginning would've stopped it.I'm pretty sure you're just tired or scared of people seeing your server as "art thieves", I recall someone saying "don't bring it to RMS" well FYI your own member did so I just made a reply. I had no intention of bringing details up in here since i believed it would be better to leave your server and its admins to their own policies of whats right but since you guys wanted to I guess I'll just state my side.

I'm sure any artist with what, 3 days? of constant flaming and a GM prolonging this, moderators not moderating, and GMs making excuses and saying that I have no rights over my own art, any artist would have acted angry.

Talking to Might was like talking to a brick wall, he just acted as stupid as any of his own forum members, moderators or whoever kept flaming and making the issue worse.

To everyone; FYI, i never got pissed before might just ignored my email and started a case of "your art shouldn't be removed" + 21321 continuous flames. I'm pretty sure after a few days of this going on it would piss any artist off. I already did try to avoid it. He knew he had it coming anyway.

I couldn't care less what you think about my art, but if you didn't like it from the start, why use it? Why prolong the issue and just not take it down? Why spend so much time defending it? Why make up things that I took hours labeling my whole DA gallery with "permission" tags because you used it? Doesn't matter if it takes 30 mins or 10 hours to draw something. Doesn't mean you have any right to steal it. Art is still art. And if you think my art was so effortless then don't use it in the first place. :)

You're not the first server using my art without permission, other servers acted maturely and said they would take it down or credit me, whichever was best and no problems came out of that. i've had permission tags since private servers started using my art. Some just credited me or responded respectfully when i notified them. In your case, Alara edited my art and you still keep making excuses and prolonged flaming, your own moderators partook instead of doing their jobs.

If you wanted to set it right, you would have said so in the reply in your email but you merely linked me to a forum and prolonged the issue with clear statements that my art shouldn't be removed so don't come in here acting like you were trying to the right thing before. Teach your designers to credit artists, so many people on DA and your own players told me how she was without permission using custom sprites / artworks without credit from others.

Regardless,

You still could have just emailed me. I guess you just don't want your precious server name to be covered in dirt. Like i said, if you're gonna be low and insult my art, don't use it :) and most especially don't make excuses for it to be kept on your site.

Since after 2 whole days of this discussion on forums you finally decide to take it down, whatever the reason it may be, its much appreciated and I end this discussion here.

On a lighter note, more people need to learn about copyright, yes, watermarks help, all my new art have been watermark if you check my gallery, but regarding a minor image in a signature its pretty sad when someone even has to steal that.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 11, 2009, 12:52 PM
:Disclaimer, according to some forum users this following post would be classified by them as QQing, and BAAAAAAAAW:

What I have said about the copyright issue, is correct and accurate. Every single bit of it. I'm sorry if you don't believe it, I just bring out the fact about it and not gibberish.


About what I have said about the what she did and did not and what she did was right etc blablabla, is my own opinion. Not fact. The above line of text however is fact.

I will take the liberty of quoting Descent's avatar text: "Brutal honesty served ice cold."
Replace Honesty with Fact and you find me.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Guest on Apr 11, 2009, 01:50 PM
okay guys, i've removed a bunch of the rather unneeded posts
but please keep this in mind, i'm not going to clean this topic twice if it comes to that im just going to lock it
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Reyl on Apr 13, 2009, 10:24 AM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 10, 2009, 02:42 PM
hmm... i think it's best to create a new topic under Hall of Shame specifically about the stolen art incident at FeelRO. I believe that's how other cases were dealt with. I recall seeing another server with your chibi art being reported at that section not too long ago.

p/s: hope you get recognised for your creative works and your wishes as an artist respected. /ok

I'd like to support bleu's idea. While I think it's nice that a resolution is starting to come through, I really don't feel like all this belongs as an addendum to my server review. As the original poster, can I request that this discussion be split into a separate thread? My review is months old by now and not even relevant to this image-theft issue.

About the issue itself, well... people tend to take desperate measures when they feel upset or threatened. It happens. But as things are, I don't think this resolution is an ideal one for either side. It's already clear that both sides made a few bad decisions, but the inconsistent stories leave me feeling as if someone is lying or overexaggerating. I don't think that's a reputation that either side (a head GM and an artist) will want to come out of this with. I hope you can talk this over privately to resolve this a bit more honestly and peaceably; if that's not possible, then I really hope this issue doesn't come back to haunt you later.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Omi on Apr 13, 2009, 02:24 PM
tl;dr

chexie I'd be glad someone is using if someone was using my art, shows how good it is.  You can't "copyright" your drawing, because it's "fanart" of an image that IS copyrighted.  Also, to be honest your art is hell terrible and anyone could look at a character sprite and draw it's head 5x bigger than normal.  oh, ps, it's the interet, what are you going to do, cry? thats about as much as you can do

on that note, i've taken all of chexies images, removed watermarks, signed it myself, and posted it on 4 accounts on deviantart and sheezyart.  if it is copyrighted, see you guys i'm going to be sued and bawed at :(
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Might_FeelRO on Apr 13, 2009, 03:58 PM
Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 11, 2009, 03:20 AM
I had a talk with Alara and we decided we don't want to be any part of this any longer, especially since drawing something like Chex's art is something that can be done in a few hours without putting any supreme effort to it. We decided to take the mature side as long as nobody seems to be taking it and replace the images. I will provide you with a link in a couple of days. See you :)   

Chexie's pictures removed from the site and replaced with the ones drawn by Alara.

http://feelro.net/SessionExpired.aspx

The image on the login screen will be replaced during next maintenance, since it requires patching everyone's client to change it.

Quote from: Chexie on Apr 11, 2009, 05:38 AM
Or was it the emails that flooded your inbox from my fellow artists that bothered you? 

Your fellow artists didnt write us a single letter.

Good bye :)


EDIT:
Quote
- Overly edited drawings of mine, and yes they are my drawings with a lot of editing done them, checked em in photoshop.OBVIOUS EDITING much? (If you check the pixel patterns in PS its an edited image.)
http://princesschex.deviantart.com/

Chexie, for God's sake, stop slandering. Those pictures were drawn out of nothing. Those arent your art, those arent edited, those are made by us from the first pixel till the last one. If you cannot even imagine that it can be done so perfectly - it's not the reason to lie about us again. If you "checked the pattern" - then check again, you were wrong. And stop it already with your obsession about your art. There is nothing so special in it that cant be done by simply a good, professional artist. And those pictures i asked Alara to make - is another proof of it. 

For everyone who is interested:

Original picture from our site, by Chexie:
(http://i43.tinypic.com/s3hax5.png)

Picture made by Alara:
(http://i41.tinypic.com/244qv5k.png)

This is the result of photoshop comparison with the "difference" filter. Black color - indicates the match.

(http://i40.tinypic.com/2j607co.png)
(http://i40.tinypic.com/2mqtjep.png)

As you can see, everything that matches - is the skin and hair color of the character standing to the left. Everything else differs. Try that for yourselves if you dont believe us.
Posted on: Apr 13, 2009, 06:39 am
Oh, and Chexie:

http://www.heartro.com/
http://www.rowragnarok.com/cp/
http://puddingsro.no-ip.info/flash/
http://u2ro.org/index.php?serverid=&content=infos

Bite!
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 13, 2009, 04:32 PM
Thats not my art besides the first one. :) It's Claire's. But thanks. will inform her since u went thru the trouble of letting me know. :) going to bed now. nightnight.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Nay on Apr 13, 2009, 04:41 PM
Are u sure?)
http://puddingsro.no-ip.info/flash/

next click DOWNLOAD - and there - forum :)

and BTW If this picture not yours it is not pity to you of its maker? )
You worry only about yourself? It is not good....
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 13, 2009, 04:42 PM
Quote from: Chexie on Apr 13, 2009, 04:32 PM
Thats not my art besides the first one. :) It's Claire's. But thanks. will inform her later of that since u went thru the trouble of letting me know. :) going to bed now. nightnight.

^

i said i would inform her :) thanks for letting me know.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Nay on Apr 13, 2009, 04:57 PM
For your friend Claire. It seems she is more popular than you :))))

http://www.nekotsuki-ro.net/TsukiHime/TsukiHime.html
http://www.nro-era.net/images/reviewRMS.jpg

http://quest-ro.com/

and your pic too

http://quest-ro.com/templates/quest/images/quest/backgrounds/header-2.jpg
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Symbiote on Apr 13, 2009, 09:10 PM
Quote from: Might_FeelRO on Apr 13, 2009, 03:58 PMOriginal picture from our site, by Chexie:
http://i43.tinypic.com/s3hax5.png

Picture made by Alara:
http://i41.tinypic.com/244qv5k.png

You've got to be kidding me. It's obvious that Alara built off of Chexie's art. The eyes are exactly the same. In fact, tons of s*** is nearly exactly the same. It's clear that Alara just remodeled Chexie's art, for the High Priest, from the Stalker. I don't really care if this s*** flies for anyone else, but I have to say it's quite sad.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: uzausa on Apr 14, 2009, 01:53 AM
What you guys did is NOT removing the pic. Rather, it was just editing the pic just to make it less obvious that you got it from someone else. I do agree that designers naturally use stock photos from other people, but it's common courtesy to credit the ones you got them from. And that picture is not 'made by Alara'. More like 'edited by Alara just to be less obvious'


And sorry if I'm sounding like such a jerk towards FeelRO's staff, but we have to get you guys to understand what you did wrong.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 14, 2009, 02:00 AM
@ Nay;

Thanks for going through the trouble of checking RO servers for me :D Now i can inform my friends as well that their work is being used without permission.

Quote from: uzausa on Apr 14, 2009, 01:53 AM
What you guys did is NOT removing the pic. Rather, it was just editing the pic just to make it less obvious that you got it from someone else. I do agree that designers naturally use stock photos from other people, but it's common courtesy to credit the ones you got them from. And that picture is not 'made by Alara'. More like 'edited by Alara just to be less obvious'


And sorry if I'm sounding like such a jerk towards FeelRO's staff, but we have to get you guys to understand what you did wrong.

Seems to be a "common" thing, saying she creates things she edited, as one of their players said before. Like here. >>

http://eathena.ws/board/lofiversion/index.php/t203228.html

*shrug* But yeah, if Alara can layer my artworks in photoshop and trace them i dunno why she doesn't make some original ones. :)

Thanks to Eruruu (http://eruruu.deviantart.com/) for sending me the stuff below; (Interesting stuff really)

Animated overlay comparisons:
(http://i44.tinypic.com/206etd4.gif)(http://i44.tinypic.com/29b0nid.gif)(http://i42.tinypic.com/2ujtu15.gif)

Overlay comparisons (jpg), with commentary!:
http://www.deviantart.com/users/outgoing?http://i43.tinypic.com/28hg6yf.jpg
http://www.deviantart.com/users/outgoing?http://i42.tinypic.com/28tzx8g.jpg
http://www.deviantart.com/users/outgoing?http://i41.tinypic.com/jkvls9.jpg

I been frankenstein'd! D=

Hopefully they decide to come to their senses. :)
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 03:18 AM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 11, 2009, 12:52 PM
:Disclaimer, according to some forum users this following post would be classified by them as QQing, and BAAAAAAAAW:

What I have said about the copyright issue, is correct and accurate. Every single bit of it. I'm sorry if you don't believe it, I just bring out the fact about it and not gibberish.


About what I have said about the what she did and did not and what she did was right etc blablabla, is my own opinion. Not fact. The above line of text however is fact.

I will take the liberty of quoting Descent's avatar text: "Brutal honesty served ice cold."
Replace Honesty with Fact and you find me.

After a discussion via PM with Silver, I agree with Silver.
The fanart is copyrighted as the person made this themselves with respect to the fact that it's fan art of Gravity's copyrighted characters.
However, you cannot sell said art, that would be copyright infringement.

We both agree that the crying over this kinda stuff is retarded.
So please, everyone grow up and stop crying over your poor pixels.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Nay on Apr 14, 2009, 04:16 AM
I cannot understand you guys...

All Ragnarok servers (that is not the official Gravity servers) - HAVE STOLEN the WHOLE GAME!!!

~~
And again if u gont get it... THEY HAVE STOLEN THE WHOLE GAME!!
~~

And now... Why they cannot use your pictures?
You should be proud. All that you could do with it to ask put a copyright on your pick and be happy.

If you did not want your work be used by some one.... You should: 1. Never post it in the Internet 2. Damage it so hard so it will not possible to use it. (Btw That you have made now with your pick will not help =P, copyright is too smal)
But.. You wanted one million admired responses and And nobody should use it? It is naive.

If you want I can find 5 more servers where I saw your works. And those works there are in a primordial form. =)) Not as at Feelro. I think they puted your copyright with pleasure if you have asked politely... but not now )) It is not your pick now, it is just your style. And im sure they can simly to draw they own girls.... but.... they do it specially for you =)

sooo....

Leave Feelro in pease and be engaged whith other servers. Your works are not present On FeelRo already. Accept the situation and fight with guys that use your primordial picks.

....
...
....
....

But better.... NEVER post  your pics in the Internet! And be happy!!

...


Best regards,

Nay.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: bleu on Apr 14, 2009, 04:27 AM
I taken the liberty to compile some important highlights of the "Stolen Artwork Case"
http://forum.feelro.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=13667&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Apr 07 Tues   5:20am
The Artist make a post on FeelRO claiming her art works were stolen and no proper accreditation made to her. She asked for her art or derivative of her works to be removed. Awaits GM reply


Apr 08 Wed
No GM reply


Apr 09 Thursday
No GM reply


Apr  10 Friday 12:59pm
GM Might gives a lecture on the difference between the words "Design" and "Create".  
No apology extended to the Artist.
And he points the finger at the Artist – it's your fault for making a Fan Art. He further explains he has every right to take any art in particular Fan Art.
He assumed that GM Alara aka CopyCat was either blind or illiterate; and had never seen the license agreement; which he swears to be invalid.
Then he further insults the Artist claiming her artworks were not created by her and most likely stolen from somewhere else which the Artist failed to give proper credit.


Apr 10 Friday 4:45pm
GM Aerandil, claims to be an artist himself.
He said GM CopyCat did not respect your art, it's your problem, you should have made clear your copyright rights.


Apr 10 Friday 5:17 pm
GM Aerandil teaches us the importance of alphabets.
Because no (c) = rights to use your art without your permission.
He also distance himself from GM CopyCat. Don't look at me, I was not the CopyCat. Go bother her instead.


Apr10 Friday 5:39 pm
GM Aerandil is French. He continues to spam.


Apr10 Friday 7:07 pm
GM Might bans her because she enlightened the rest of the RO /Art community through RMS Forum/DeviantArt on the issue. Didn't know we have to seek permission from GM Might before we are allowed to express ourselves on RMS Forum? Must be a new rule!


Apr10 Friday  (unspecified time)
The Artist advertised a rival server to FeelRO's forum members. Not really talking much about art, but bashing FeelRO – being outdated in RO contents, invisible GMs, etc..


1.   FeelRO GMs/Mods either can't spell or don't use spell check.
       GM Aerandil: Patience is a vertue.
       Bape: Alara has a copy write on the website why?

2.   Tortoise response time. It takes more than 3 days to get any official GM response. Where is GM CopyCat during all of this? She did not make a
        single post among the 14 pages within a span of 4 days.

3.      FeelRO GMs are big bullies.

4.      FeelRO GMs does not understand how the PR game is played.
        Is it that difficult to say "I am Sorry. I should not have taken your artworks without your permission. And since you requested your artworks to be
        taken off the server. We shall respect your wishes."
        Do you think this is merely about a few artworks?
        Is it worth all this trouble and bad publicity?   

5.     The sever bashing PM sent out by the Artist was wrong. But had you guys responded earlier and reacted faster and smarter. This would not have
        happened.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 04:49 AM
So immature staff on that server.
I'll take note never to promote or play that server.
Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: uzausa on Apr 14, 2009, 05:08 AM
Gravity does have copyrights, but I believe that they still allow private servers to exist as long as they retain the rules of the game.


I think never posting someone's artwork is just silly. Art is expression. No matter how cliche that phrase is, it's true. You'll need someone to see your work to fulfill the 'expression' part. [: Using pictures from another person SHOULD be a compliment for that artist. But it wouldn't be a compliment if the watermarks/ signature is purposely removed. I do believe that some pictures don't have watermarks on them, but I saw with my own four eyes that one of the pictures had the artist's name on it.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 05:16 AM
Quote from: uzausa on Apr 14, 2009, 05:08 AM
Gravity does have copyrights, but I believe that they still allow private servers to exist as long as they retain the rules of the game.

Gravity lets private servers exist because they cannot sue thousands of 12 year olds and they dogs for running servers. They'd lose more money than they'd make.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 14, 2009, 05:38 AM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 14, 2009, 04:27 AM
Where is GM CopyCat during all of this? She did not make a single post among the 14 pages within a span of 4 days.

Prolly too busy hanging out on my deviantart page, who I noticed kept going around my site the day I made that thread, along with another user called "FeelRO" who started doing the same yesterday (apparently made a DA account today.) which is kinda surprising cause if it is them, they have more time to stay updated with my DA and hangout on RMS reading entries rather than address issues on their forum from the looks of it.

Honestly though, GM Might still should have removed it (edited or non-edited, or traced) like he said he would if he really wanted this issue to end. Not make Alara play mr. potato head trace a sketch like what they did. They obviously have time to do silly things like this, If Alara could draw from the start, I wonder why not let her make something better, original and uniquely hers from the very beginning if they never liked my art anyway.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Nithalm on Apr 14, 2009, 10:01 AM
Hundreds of servers rely on 'someone else' his artwork for websites and such....
This discussion..... is that what await any bigger server?
Blue had grabbed the main reason why this went out of control. I think main GM's didnt saw this for 3 day's.
It is understandable that Chexie had the idea he/she was ignored by the staff.
But i can also understand that the GM's are not pleased that this went to public, before they were able to do anything.
I also think everyone under-estimated this incident a bit, how big this would grow....

Quote from: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 04:49 AM
So immature staff on that server.
I'll take note never to promote or play that server.
Thanks for the info.
I played the server for 14 months, and i cannot find myself in your comment. I would not describe them as 'immature'.
FeelRO staff is not flawless, but i am suprised a administrator of RMS take such heavy conclusion into public.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Elymn on Apr 14, 2009, 10:15 AM
Well my views on this issue is that Chex got too irritated from the immature members from feelRO. However, after reading half of the thread (on feelRO) and all the GM replies, I'll say that the some of the GMs are just as immature as their members. But seriously Chex... what did you expect? When members can go around trolling and flaming like they did and the GMs didn't do anything about it. Also, you see that really beautiful sinx / hw painting they have at the front page... that's another work from DA, do you really think they credited / asked for permission from the actual creator? No, instead they destroyed it by having some badly cropped [use anti aliasing next time :)], poorly animated leafs that fly over the characters.

I've played on this for about a month and a half, I feel that it is not a friendly place. Most of their members try too hard to be e-thugs. Trolling, flaming, and pretty much the only thing they know how to say is "QQ more". Some of their GMs act the same way, except they're a little bit smarter so they reword it to seem polite of course. However, it's really hard to see how the GMs act since you can never actually contact them...

QuoteApr  10 Friday 12:59pm
GM Might gives a lecture on the difference between the words "Design" and "Create".  
No apology extended to the Artist.
And he points the finger at the Artist – it's your fault for making a Fan Art. He further explains he has every right to take any art in particular Fan Art.
He assumed that GM Alara aka CopyCat was either blind or illiterate; and had never seen the license agreement; which he swears to be invalid.
Then he further insults the Artist claiming her artworks were not created by her and most likely stolen from somewhere else which the Artist failed to give proper credit.

But not being able to contact a GM is actually somewhat of a good thing on this server. This way you can create and keep the illusion that feelRO has decent GMs.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 14, 2009, 12:32 PM
People on the internet are lazy and they're ****.

There. Perfect ending for the thread.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 01:37 PM
Quote from: Nithalm on Apr 14, 2009, 10:01 AM
Hundreds of servers rely on 'someone else' his artwork for websites and such....
This discussion..... is that what await any bigger server?
Blue had grabbed the main reason why this went out of control. I think main GM's didnt saw this for 3 day's.
It is understandable that Chexie had the idea he/she was ignored by the staff.
But i can also understand that the GM's are not pleased that this went to public, before they were able to do anything.
I also think everyone under-estimated this incident a bit, how big this would grow....

Quote from: Zone on Apr 14, 2009, 04:49 AM
So immature staff on that server.
I'll take note never to promote or play that server.
Thanks for the info.
I played the server for 14 months, and i cannot find myself in your comment. I would not describe them as 'immature'.
FeelRO staff is not flawless, but i am suprised a administrator of RMS take such heavy conclusion into public.

I'm not an administrator of RMS, read my damn title.
I'm the VShield Administrator.
I played FeelRO for about 30 minutes, I left their main town only to see the autovenders around the server because it was such a s*** hole.
The most unorganized I've ever seen. It's basically a dump of stuff just sitting there, trying to look pretty, but the main town alone makes me want to rage. No one likes a cluttered main town.
Also, they aren't the biggest server, I did see entire maps filled with autovenders. So their population means nothing.
Just like the other servers who claim ~2k player base.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Nithalm on Apr 14, 2009, 07:49 PM
Whatever kind of adminstrator, your first reasoning to not playing a server seemed a bit dull on me.
Your second explanation to 'not like FeelRO', is better, as you speak at least now about your own experience.

To think of that running Ragnarok server software and altering Ragnarok exe is not really legal,
but once it come down to two pictures, everyone have suddenly so much moral.....
I was especting a bit some sort of 'neutrality' from everyone who has 'administrator' in his name, as they likely would have also experiece running a server and such..... at least a mild understanding....
But to declare FeelRO a 'no-go' area based on one incident, while even the GM's tried to solve it, seemed pretty harsh on me.
Everyone makes mistakes, FeelRO staff as well. If people want the best quality, people should play official server.
For a free server, i think FeelRO is doing a decent job.

Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Ayu on Apr 14, 2009, 09:13 PM
Quote from: Nithalm on Apr 14, 2009, 07:49 PM
But to declare FeelRO a 'no-go' area based on one incident, while even the GM's tried to solve it, seemed pretty harsh on me.
Everyone makes mistakes, FeelRO staff as well. If people want the best quality, people should play official server.
For a free server, i think FeelRO is doing a decent job.

The world of private servers don't work that way because there is more than 1 private server out there. When people got options, private servers need certain level of quality if they want to retain their players. Why stay if someone else does the same thing better? And not everyone thinks that official servers, just because it has a monthly cost, is it necessary the best quality either. The idea of official vs private server for quality vary from people to people.

It's up to FeelRO's players if they still have faith in their GM team or not that they should be given second chance and if they think that the GMs will learn from their error. If they do, then they will stay and support the server to recover. If this kind of thing crosses the line, then plenty of servers out there.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: thirtythree on Apr 15, 2009, 05:39 PM

@Chexie: I don't know you or have anything against you or your artwork (you actually have some impressive webdesign skills) but after reading about this whole fiasco I have to say you've acted very poorly. I can understand being frustrated and angry because fanart/watermarks or not it was something you took the time to draw for yourself or a friend, but you still could've handled it MUCH better and more professionally instead of spending so much time pointing fingers and responding constantly while getting emotional. Giving in to trolling and criticism only caused people to lose respect for you, giving the GMs and administrators reason enough not to take you seriously (yes, they could've been more mature... but you should've aswell). I'd suggest calming down and stepping away from all of this!
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 15, 2009, 05:50 PM
Thirythree, this isn't being discussed anymore~
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 15, 2009, 05:50 PM
Thirythree, this isn't being discussed anymore~

says who? you? if this isn't discussed anymore then this topic should be closed/locked.


Regards.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 15, 2009, 07:36 PM
Quote from: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
This topic needs be closed/locked.


Regards.

Fixed.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: bleu on Apr 15, 2009, 08:44 PM
Quote from: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 15, 2009, 07:36 PM
Quote from: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
This topic [/b]needs[/b] be closed/locked.

Regards.

Fixed.

But but but... we have yet to hear from Alara. A pivotal character in this saga.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 16, 2009, 12:16 AM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 15, 2009, 08:44 PM
Quote from: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 15, 2009, 07:36 PM
Quote from: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
This topic [/b]needs[/b] be closed/locked.

Regards.

Fixed.

But but but... we have yet to hear from Alara. A pivotal character in this saga.

Apparently she can't communicate through english.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: wireless on Apr 16, 2009, 05:15 AM
Maybe just dump this thread in the soap opera forum? Seems like the most suitable place for this :-X
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: LiteX on Apr 16, 2009, 06:26 AM
Quote from: Nithalm on Apr 14, 2009, 07:49 PM
Whatever kind of adminstrator, your first reasoning to not playing a server seemed a bit dull on me.
Your second explanation to 'not like FeelRO', is better, as you speak at least now about your own experience.

To think of that running Ragnarok server software and altering Ragnarok exe is not really legal,
but once it come down to two pictures, everyone have suddenly so much moral.....
I was especting a bit some sort of 'neutrality' from everyone who has 'administrator' in his name, as they likely would have also experiece running a server and such..... at least a mild understanding....
But to declare FeelRO a 'no-go' area based on one incident, while even the GM's tried to solve it, seemed pretty harsh on me.
Everyone makes mistakes, FeelRO staff as well. If people want the best quality, people should play official server.
For a free server, i think FeelRO is doing a decent job.



See the bold area? that is a major flaw in your argument, alot of people make pservers, yes, it is true, but what makes it different from FeelRO's admins' actions?
Simple, FeelRO's GMs were saying that THEY made the fanart, not Chexie, making a private server you will give credit to Gravity(Not saying "I MADE 100% OF THIS GAME!", you will get your donkey sued if you do that), plus ,even though Chexie asked to remove it, they didnt, and to fix Alara's english problem, use a translator, even though everything will be choppy, it's better than Alara not reading this...
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: A92FL0163 on Apr 16, 2009, 12:05 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 16, 2009, 12:16 AM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 15, 2009, 08:44 PM
Quote from: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 15, 2009, 07:36 PM
Quote from: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
This topic [/b]needs[/b] be closed/locked.

Regards.

Fixed.

But but but... we have yet to hear from Alara. A pivotal character in this saga.

Apparently she can't communicate through english.

Go at recruitment section and check the language she can speak, ask someone if can make a translation  between each other, that way you can solve it with each other.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: Chexie on Apr 16, 2009, 01:05 PM
Quote from: SilverStream~ on Apr 16, 2009, 12:16 AM
Quote from: bleu on Apr 15, 2009, 08:44 PM
Quote from: LemonCrosswalk on Apr 15, 2009, 07:36 PM
Quote from: Shinn on Apr 15, 2009, 06:30 PM
This topic [/b]needs[/b] be closed/locked.

Regards.

Fixed.

But but but... we have yet to hear from Alara. A pivotal character in this saga.

Apparently she can't communicate through english.

She doesnt need a translator, her english is actually very good. If you check FeelRO forums you'll kinda get what I mean;

"We will make a size limit on the pictures, but until then we will not increase quantity of letters in signatures."
"We will not add Valkyrie Helm on our server =) You can find it on any other server. So it will be never added as donation. "
"These are very beautiful drawings ^__^"

I'm sure if she can speak perfect English on FeelRO she has no problems speaking about the issue, if she wanted to she would've but she clearly chose not to. It's her choice if she wishes to do whatever Might and herself have been amusing themselves with. She was always present when the issue was being discussed but decided to keep hush hush. I'm sure she just doesn't want any confrontation with the issue since some people also have problem with her giving wrong credit regarding sprite edits as well. Can't totally blame her. Personally, I think she could probably be a good artist but if she chooses to limit herself to other people's art and not giving proper credit in the end its her loss sadly.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: John Locke on Apr 18, 2009, 07:37 PM
Lol. Just Wanted to state this topic should not be locked, even if the usual noisemakers appeared and claimed for it. (for their imbalanced server sake)


I made a true server review "update" just 1 week before this incident happen....
.... and i think its worth being readed. Althought I doubt most will read it with all this pages of "the art incident", yet the incident and all this.... post.... with the "new artworks" (irony) is...... sad.



Truth be said i would be happy if feelro dies and a good bunch of mid rate populaiton ( "new"  RO
population tired of low rates) becomes "free" to join other mid rate servers.

Anyway the mid rates out there (check my server seeking post) doesnt seem to have a clear idea about what they aim to for WoE. Bad stuff. As i suggested some time ago servers should have a WoE time decided before even being allowed to show their name here.

Make a new  server then let 2 pinoy guilds ( no racism, but this happens SO often) that are the first to join the server to choose the WoE time is just very SAD.

Peace, and im yet on a RO break while hoping for a mid rate with good american+European WoE times i.e. around 20:00 gmt +0 saturday and sunday.


pd: yeah I used the post for my RO migration theorys again.
Title: Re: FeelRO
Post by: SilverStream~ on Apr 19, 2009, 05:40 PM
You know, I think TalonRO's woe times are around that.

I can see if I can link you to it~



Yup, here: TalonRO woe (http://talonro.com/woe.php)


Seems like up your alley, but it's on wensday that one woe.

Well, check it out I just saw a coincidence here over the hours you want =)