EssenceRO & RMS Dispute

[Symbiote]

First of all, let me start off by posting a screenshot of my initial RateMyServer System review.



Now, I'll post a screenshot of the guidelines for posting a RateMyServer System review.



And thus, I'll throw you all an important question. What exactly does my review violate in the guidelines to warrant removal?

1) My review gives quite the explanation of the server, as much as a s*** 330 character limit allows, for vital information.

2) My review does not consist of trolling and/or personal attack(s). I lay out my opinion of the server in general and the staff that make it what it is, which is what a review is intended to do.

3) My review does not contain a single vulgarity.

4) My review does not mention another server, and only directly mentions the Administrator to make it clear that it is not just the GMs causing issues.

5) My review does not contain any links whatsoever.

6) My review does not contain any information regarding "fraudulent practices," and the information that my review does contain is explained "on the forums," as my review states the reader should follow up on. (yC even recommends linking to a forum review, but with a 330 character limit, what the hell am I going to be able to write aside from the URL, exactly?)

7) My review does not refer to the inability to connect at all.

8) My review is an honest and critical summarization of recent, important events on the server, explaining the overall experience one that is involved will gain from playing the server. It does not have the intention to raise nor lower the score.

9) My review mentions no other reviews.

10) My review tells plenty about the server, and is not supporting any server.

Yet, I was faced with my review being deleted by yC, not once, but twice, and I was greeted with a personal message on the forums:

Hello,

This should be the second time your review has been deleted.  This is because your review is not really a review about the server but a complain or alert on the security of the server. 

I believe in your case, you should create a separate topic in the server review section of the forum.  Do an in depth review of the server (with mention of your experience in game, gm, community,  etc. with rating for each) and also mention the security remark if you wish.  Then provide link of the forum topic in ur "on site" short review.

Otherwise, I can only suggest you to make your complain of the server security to the server itself. 

Thank you for your attention.

- yC

To which I responded pointing out that it was in fact all about the server, especially considering security is a vital part of a server, and mentioned that I would have gladly included more, and a URL, if the limit was not capped at 330. Which, I also mentioned, that I had already created a thread regarding the small limit, only to gain no sensible response by yC. (I would quote my response, but I did not save it to my Outbox)

In response, I received:

I am doing my job of telling you why your review was deleted.  If you fail to listen and continue to do as you wish, that will leave me no choice but to remove your right to review the server for harassment.

You should get the attention of the server staff to fix the problem, nothing is going to change by posting the problem in a review.

Clearly, yC is unaware of her own guidelines if she believes that she is 'doing her job.' Suggesting that I get the attention of the server whom I am reviewing's staff to "fix the problem" is quite amusing, considering the same could be suggested for any bad review on any server, and often the staff isn't very interested in changing their ways. What's the point in reviewing the negative lights of a server if you're just going to be given that response? There isn't one.

So, I will proceed to repost my review, seeing as how it breaks zero guidelines and reviews the server well in what 330 characters will allow. I honestly have to ask what exactly yC believes she is doing, when there are only about a million reviews that do break the guidelines that need removing, yet, mine seems to be top priority.

If the character limit is raised to 500, I will add more to it, and even post a link to my minireviews in the other EssenceRO thread (or this one). This thread also serves as a review, but nothing more than an addon to the review in my screenshot at the beginning of the thread. The following are links to my individual posts in another thread, to suffice for one thread to link to in a future RateMyServer System review, if the character limit is raised, as it should be.

Minireview Part 1
Minireview Part 2
Minireview Part 3
Minireview Part 4
Minireview Part 5

[Ailinea]

Not that I am taking sides, but just pointing out:  I believe "corrupt, liar-filled staff" falls under personal attacks.  Whether it's true or not, it's a personal attack.  You already directed the reader to your topic, it could have been stated there and not in the review.

[Symbiote]

Not that I am taking sides, but just pointing out:  I believe "corrupt, liar-filled staff" falls under personal attacks.  Whether it's true or not, it's a personal attack.  You already directed the reader to your topic, it could have been stated there and not in the review.

Corrupt, liar-filled staff is not a personal attack. It describes the staff of the server. I actually added that in to give more information on the server, to reduce the chances of the review being removed. If that truly is a "personal attack," that portion can easily be removed/replaced. However, I have a feeling that my review will still get removed, regardless that it breaks no guidelines. yC didn't even mention "personal attacks" in her reasoning for removing it, after all.

[yC]

Well, you are forgetting that you are not arguing with me but the rules.  Anyone who have their reviews deleted either didn't read the guidelines or think their review is not breaking any rules.  Of course you are not the first person that think your review does not break any guidelines.

Let see.  Your review:

Essence security is horrible. I was able to have unauthorized Admin access for a year, and take control of the server on Halloween '08. Tira and the staff still did not learn their lesson. They recently allowed a virus to be passed among the community through their patchers. Corrupt, liar-filled staff. Read RMS forums for more.
See Detailed Rating
Rating: 49
Report This Comment
Comment #1
Server
Stability: 7
Availability: 8
Community
Friendliness: 4
Eventfulness: 5
Game Masters
Friendliness: 4
Availability: 3
Helpfulness: 4
Game-play
Economy: 2
Guild Competition: 5
Class Balance: 7

and it is breaking rule #1:

# 1) Reviews that do not give any explanation for the score given (no matter the score is high or low) will be deleted. i.e. "Best Server out there!", "Join Join Join <3", "This server SUCKS!", "GM corrupted the server. 10/100" Why "gm corrupted" will be deleted? Because it does not give a fair score with respect to the Stability/Availability etc. 

Why?

Security is not part of the rating categories,
your unauthoerize admin access is not part of the rating categories,
you take control of the server is not part of the rating categories,
Tira and staff = gm not learn their lesson.  On what?  yes, security of the server, which is not part of the rating categories,
virus in patcher is not part of the rating categories.

So after taking the review apart and ignoring those that are not part of the rating categories.
Now what's left in the review is "Corrupt, liar-filled staff".  That is a breaking of rule #1 and possibly #2 if taken as a troll.

Further, 'unauthorized admin access' and 'virus in patcher' does not explain any bit of the following.

Server
Stability: 7
Availability: 8

Community
Friendliness: 4
Eventfulness: 5

Game Masters
Friendliness: 4
Availability: 3
Helpfulness: 4

Game-play
Economy: 2
Guild Competition: 5
Class Balance: 7

Like I always said, a review should be your experience on the server.  We will not take 'unauthorized admin access' and 'virus in patcher' as part of player experience on the server.

You should shift the attention of your claim to the server itself.

[Symbiote]

and it is breaking rule #1:

Why?

Security is not part of the rating categories,
your unauthoerize admin access is not part of the rating categories,
you take control of the server is not part of the rating categories,
Tira and staff = gm not learn their lesson.  On what?  yes, security of the server, which is not part of the rating categories,
virus in patcher is not part of the rating categories.

So after taking the review apart and ignoring those that are not part of the rating categories.
Now what's left in the review is "Corrupt, liar-filled staff".  That is a breaking of rule #1 and possibly #2 if taken as a troll.

Further, 'unauthorized admin access' and 'virus in patcher' does not explain any bit of the following.

Like I always said, a review should be your experience on the server.  We will not take 'unauthorized admin access' and 'virus in patcher' as part of player experience on the server.

You should shift the attention of your claim to the server itself.

You're incorrect, again, yC! My review is heavily based on the staff, thus, it explains why I rated the staff the way I did. And the staff do have their own category, do they not? People get off by putting two-word descriptions of why they rated one or two things some way, for example, "lag" explaining why they rated Stability or Availability low. You've really got to be kidding me if you're going to try this s*** as a reason why my review is being removed. I can easily replace "corrupt, liar-filled staff" with "lag," and you'd still conjure up another reason to remove it.

However, "unauthorized admin access" and "virus in patcher" is a part of player experience. Especially the virus that was passed around in the patcher. You cannot be sane and/or sensible and deny such a thing, seeing as how nearly everyone must run the patcher to play the server.

In any case, in summarization, my review is based heavily on the staff and it gives reasoning as to why I rated the staff the way I did, and could also be considered an explanation for my server stability and availability ratings. The staff is obviously not very helpful if they're lacking on security, as well as allowing a virus to be passed through the patcher.

Regardless, I will follow in suit with every other reviewer, and replace the "corrupt, liar-filled staff" sentence with "server is laggy," though, that line sure as hell isn't "trolling." Then what reason are you going to use to remove it, Miss yC? I look forward to you spending another half an hour responding. English is difficult, isn't it?

[yC]

If you are not going to listen, I won't spend time trying to explain to you.  Afterall, the rule is there and it's up to anyone to manipulate to the way he or she wants.  At the end of the day, only the RMS staff will judge and manipulation will not win.

I provided you the solution in my first PM (link to a forum in depth review topic created by you).

I also told you the consequence on the second PM:

I am doing my job of telling you why your review was deleted.  If you fail to listen and continue to do as you wish, that will leave me no choice but to remove your right to review the server for harassment.

You should get the attention of the server staff to fix the problem, nothing is going to change by posting the problem in a review.

I am pretty sure you posted the same review 2 times before I sent the first PM and once after I sent the second PM.

That already led you to the consequence of the second PM.  Regardless of making the review a 4th time with slight changes.

Your right to review the server has been removed.  However, you are still welcome to write an in depth review for the server with all respect given to the sectional guidelines of the server review board.

Moving this to server report section.

[Symbiote]

If you are not going to listen, I won't spend time trying to explain to you.  Afterall, the rule is there and it's up to anyone to manipulate to the way he or she wants.  At the end of the day, only the RMS staff will judge and manipulation will not win.

Nothing is being manipulated, dear! My review now breaks no guideline in any way whatsoever. Anyone that reads it can agree. Actually, my review is much more in depth than 90% of the reviews that are remaining. Do you honestly want me to go through and pick out every single review that I can find that has the same exact amount of supportive information/less than my own? I'll gladly do so just to show that you're on a power trip.

I provided you the solution in my first PM (link to a forum in depth review topic created by you).

Your solution was to include a URL, 330 characters is not enough for a decent review + URL. Sorry! Already explained this.

I also told you the consequence on the second PM:

I am pretty sure you posted the same review 2 times before I sent the first PM and once after I sent the second PM.

That already led you to the consequence of the second PM.  Regardless of making the review a 4th time with slight changes.

Your right to review the server has been removed.

I will continue to make new accounts and continue reviewing the server, seeing as how I am not breaking any guidelines with my new review. You may continue to flaunt your idiocy as you please, as proxies are unlimited, thankfully.

[Yoda]

uuuh I think its awesome you've defended your review, but insult yC, who is literally the OWNER of RMS, is only gonna end badly............

[yC]

The solution was to put an URL in your review, 330 char is more than enough for an URL to the RMS forum.  Which part do you not understand.  I did not tell you to ADD to the review but to put your entire review in a new forum topic and simply link to it.  I could still allow you to do that if you wish.  You can create the topic and notify me to get you off the harassment list to post the review with only the URL.  That's if, your in depth review will cover more aspect of the server than your admin access and virus.

The procedure is correct, I told you the consequence.  You still do it, you expect the consequence.  Regardless of me being owner of whatever or not.

Multiple account, now you are turning into a trouble maker, rule breaker and what not.  Not going to respond to that except do what the Terms of Services say when it happens.

[Symbiote]

The solution was to put an URL in your review, 330 char is more than enough for an URL to the RMS forum.  Which part do you not understand.  I did not tell you to ADD to the review but to put your entire review in a new forum topic and simply link to it.  I could still allow you to do that if you wish.  You can create the topic and notify me to get you off the harassment list to post the review with only the URL.  That's if, your in depth review will cover more aspect of the server than your admin access and virus.

I refuse to post up a review with only a URL, as you and I both know that people usually don't look past the reviews. The chances of someone actually going to the URL? With the Ragnarok community, I'd say 20%. That's 1/5 people, which is a bit ridiculous, especially when my current review follows guidelines perfectly. My current review, in fact, already covers more than my admin access and a virus. It covers my overall thoughts on the server and the fact that the server has lag issues.

The procedure is correct, I told you the consequence.  You still do it, you expect the consequence.  Regardless of me being owner of whatever or not.

Multiple account, now you are turning into a trouble maker, rule breaker and what not.  Not going to respond to that except do what the Terms of Services say when it happens.

Multiple accounts because you fail to do your job properly! Under that circumstance, surely it can't really be seen as breaking any rules when logic is thrown into the equation. If I have to go around your poor judgment to keep my review that breaks no rules visible, I will do so. Gladly.

[Shinn]

To whom ever this may concern,

Sooo basically, the server gives of viruses to players and RMS staff thinks this should NOT be included in the reviews of the server, because it doesn't fit any "category" of the review system?

Perfect.


-Shinn.

[yC]

To whom ever this may concern,

Sooo basically, the server gives of viruses to players and RMS staff thinks this should NOT be included in the reviews of the server, because it doesn't fit any "category" of the review system?

Perfect.


-Shinn.

Like I said, you should direct the problem to the server in question.  Writing a review isn't going to solve it.  If it cause damage to your computer, you can even sue them for $.

Actually I should ask, where is the virus? what is the virus called.  If it's still there I'll try to get Zone (he said he's pro at it ..) to verify the content.  I mean there are plenty of people that downloaded their client I suppose.  Why nobody else's anti-virus caught it except yours.

You know, when someone reported a virus on a server's website or somewhere.  I will try to verify it and if it will be harmful to our users, I will remove the server until the problem is fixed.  Writing a review about it is not going to help at all.

[Symbiote]

Like I said, you should direct the problem to the server in question.  Writing a review isn't going to solve it.  If it cause damage to your computer, you can even sue them for $.

Actually I should ask, where is the virus? what is the virus called.  If it's still there I'll try to get Zone (he said he's pro at it ..) to verify the content.  I mean there are plenty of people that downloaded their client I suppose.  Why nobody else's anti-virus caught it except yours.

You know, when someone reported a virus on a server's website or somewhere.  I will try to verify it and if it will be harmful to our users, I will remove the server until the problem is fixed.  Writing a review about it is not going to help at all.

I'm completely failing to see your point. Why is that? Because you don't have one. It's a review, it isn't complaining about being unable to figure out how to remove the virus, nor is it about seeking a lawsuit for damages. The review informs the players of what is occurring on the server and how well the staff handles such things. And in this case, the answer to that is "bad." Again, there are no guidelines broken in my review. Read it a few million more times if you're still failing to comprehend that simple fact.

The virus has already been identified and removed from the patcher, but was active for at least a week to infect players freely. It was already presumed to be a version of a virus by the alias of "Daonol."

[yC]

I think this simply apply better on your case:

Read it a few million more times if you're still failing to comprehend that simple fact.

http://www.ratemyserver.net/forum/index.php/topic,9141.msg64015.html#msg64015

http://www.ratemyserver.net/forum/index.php/topic,9141.msg64021.html#msg64021

Other than that, we are going in circle so just read and keep reading for as many times as you want.

You said you refuse my suggestion because only 20% of people will read further.  Well I don't know where you get that from, you watch people browse the site in an internet cafe 24/7?  Anyway, there are plenty other reviews made in the forum and the site.  Why do you think you need more attention than others?  Are you special? 

If you calculated the attention you will get is 20% and that you find it ridiculous, you don't have to force yourself on that.   

[Symbiote]

I think this simply apply better on your case:

http://www.ratemyserver.net/forum/index.php/topic,9141.msg64015.html#msg64015

http://www.ratemyserver.net/forum/index.php/topic,9141.msg64021.html#msg64021

Other than that, we are going in circle so just read and keep reading for as many times as you want.

Sounds fine to me. I'll just keep posting my review that you have zero reason to remove in the first place. Benefits me more, really. After all, every time I make a new review, it shows up in the latest reviews on the very front page!