Why don't you like 3rd Jobs?

Started by eKoh, Jul 23, 2014, 02:04 AM

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eKoh

I hate these, because they make easier to kill Mvps, also it promotes Soloing which is freaking boring.

The only good thing about these 3rd Jobs is that Pvp is good when well balanced formulas are implemented. I can say this only for HRs, I've never try it on LRs/MRs.
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Judgement

You can argue the same thing with Trans classes.

Trans class comes out > those old MvPs like Lord of Death and Dark Lord become easy.
Third class comes out > those old MvPs  like Valkyrie and Ifrit become easy.
Super Smash Brothers 64!

Royal

Quote from: Judgement on Jul 23, 2014, 03:14 AM
You can argue the same thing with Trans classes.

Trans class comes out > those old MvPs like Lord of Death and Dark Lord become easy.
Third class comes out > those old MvPs  like Valkyrie and Ifrit become easy.

This pretty much sums up everything. Imo, third classes ruin almost all type of gameplay. But I must admit, some of their sprites look cool  /ok.

Razer

They dont ruin the gameplay if you bring renewal with them. The damage reduction works differently, the skills work differently. Ifrit is one of the hardest MVPS(With Bee, Morroc and GH nightmare) to solo in iRO. Even the best players need to make a team for Ifrit.

The older third classes were re modified several times by Gravity. Additionally, I wont judge them by how some SHR servers implemented them. Those were shoddy implementations by people who had no understanding game mechanics or damage formulas.

Renewal is fun, if you ask me but it is totally changes the game from pre renewal. In short Ragnarok Renewal is almost a different game. If you love the old classical game stay away from renewal.

ElariaRO

Quote from: Razer on Jul 23, 2014, 05:22 AM
They dont ruin the gameplay if you bring renewal with them. The damage reduction works differently, the skills work differently. Ifrit is one of the hardest MVPS(With Bee, Morroc and GH nightmare) to solo in iRO. Even the best players need to make a team for Ifrit.

The older third classes were re modified several times by Gravity. Additionally, I wont judge them by how some SHR servers implemented them. Those were shoddy implementations by people who had no understanding game mechanics or damage formulas.

Renewal is fun, if you ask me but it is totally changes the game from pre renewal. In short Ragnarok Renewal is almost a different game. If you love the old classical game stay away from renewal.

^ Can't add anything else to that. Renewal isn't that bad but I think most people dislike changes in things they know and like. =b

Senpai Touched Me

Also on top of that, not a lot of servers can offer a good 3rd job balanced classes because most of the times admins are lazy or they just don't know what to do.

Like shura in pvp, they go and rape every living person on their AOE asuras pretty much. And that is a problem  /ok

But I myself am looking for a HR / SHR server to play in right now with 3rd classes (except dreamerRo), because I'm bored and I want a change of pace, something to mess around in and have fun you know?  But to each their own.

Gene

Quote from: eKoh on Jul 23, 2014, 02:04 AM
Soloing which is freaking boring.
As a soloist, I find this offensive.

Though I agree with Renewal being a bit meh (I tried two renewal servers) RO was really good pre-re, renewal is OK but it copies some common game features such as exp and droprate penalties on grinding, relying on quests to level up "fast", and some other things.

The only thing I noticed that was good on renewal was weapon changes, making level 4 weapons quite effective.

Buckyx

classic became too boring, renewal is at least for me something different and new I can explore and try because this game is very old to enjoy, everytime the same grind I lvl up and then hunt gear or farm zeny then I quit bored before I gear up for WoE lol

ggwp

3rd job server are facing WoE / Siege set problem since Ygg become delayed (berry 5s and seed 3s). If they implement those set , it become so hard to kill people in PvP (just think glorious with slot /wah) and without those , OP class can massacre other with ease.

Then it got "buff dependecies" since Distorted Crescent Moon (Zangetsu) and or Odin Power give omgwtfroflmao atk and matk increase. Example would be 160k damage AD on Wounded Morroc become 300k damage  /... or Warlock capable one shotting people with just Chain Lightning using Empowered Mora set. Sacrament is needed on almost every job. FCP become necessary since more job can do strip / break (RG , WL , GX , SC and Gene)

More item needed if you want to stay competitive. Genetic now able to make +20 stat dish (and you can use it with 1-10 dish resulting up to +30 stat) and HP Large Potion. While SP Large Potion , Vitata 500 and Enriched Celermine Juice may help some job. RK need to make rune , GX need to make poison , Gene need to make more type of bottle , Sorc need elemental stone

Ranger become King of PvM with Arrow Storm using White Wing set and Elven Bow dishing more than 50k damage (selfbuffed and still using neutral element) on 11x11 aoe. Its capable one shotting anything below biolab 4 making farming with other job pointless.

Ill stop the rant here so it wont become giant wall of text  /heh.

OrionQuest

What it really boils down to is change.  People fear change, they don't like people messing with a game that's never changed for almost 10 years now, it means they have to re-learn everything.  They have to collect different sets of gear, use different cards, change stats and builds, etc.  But, a game that never changes eventually makes the game stagnate, once you hit your ultimate goal or cap, there's not much you can do any longer.  Online games were never meant to just stop at a certain point and no longer change, doing that only hurts the game in the long run.  People who hate the changes leave, people who never like the original might give the new version a try, and the cycle continues.  Most people outright dismiss Renewal because it brought too many changes to the game.  For better or worse Gravity did the right thing, RO was never meant to stay the same way forever, if you can't adapt to the newer versions, you're doomed to play the same game without any real improvements to an already old model of an already old game. 

Gene

Quote from: OrionQuest on Jul 23, 2014, 06:20 PM
What it really boils down to is change.  People fear change, they don't like people messing with a game that's never changed for almost 10 years now, it means they have to re-learn everything.  They have to collect different sets of gear, use different cards, change stats and builds, etc.  But, a game that never changes eventually makes the game stagnate, once you hit your ultimate goal or cap, there's not much you can do any longer.  Online games were never meant to just stop at a certain point and no longer change, doing that only hurts the game in the long run.  People who hate the changes leave, people who never like the original might give the new version a try, and the cycle continues.  Most people outright dismiss Renewal because it brought too many changes to the game.  For better or worse Gravity did the right thing, RO was never meant to stay the same way forever, if you can't adapt to the newer versions, you're doomed to play the same game without any real improvements to an already old model of an already old game.

Based on the results, I'm quite positive that Gravity did not do the right thing...you explained it yourself.

eKoh

Quote from: Gene on Jul 24, 2014, 06:04 AM
Based on the results, I'm quite positive that Gravity did not do the right thing...you explained it yourself.

Lol, I totally agree with you man. Gravity had a good intentions but bad execution.

Why?

So simple, when something that you are really used to be with, suddenly changes, you hate that change.

What gravity should've done, is to add 3rd jobs and renewal but, not affecting the current gameplay.

Like forbid renewal and 3rd jobs skills on old maps, like abbey, odin temple, this way we're not changing the old way to kill randgris/beelzebub. But adding new maps that renewal mechanics and also adding 3rd jobs skills are working, and also the Mvps/Mobs in there should be enough hard for 3rd jobs.

This way we are not changing the old style of RO, but adding a new RO style that can be more fun.

well that what I think that gravity should have done
We are a Pre-Renewal Midrate. Looking for the most
competitive
scene in Pvp, Mvp, and Hunting!


Grand Opening this July 15th!
Visit Aria-RO.com

OrionQuest

What you described isn't any type of improvement.  I get that people liked that 150 dex gets you instant cast, I get that certain classes will always function the same way, but the game as a whole is bad for it.  None of us should have ever expected the game's mechanics, systems, classes or even class balance to be almost the exact same for that long.  If you want to blame Gravity, be my guest, but the fault is ours.  People are too stubborn to accept the game had to evolve, we fear the changes and blame Gravity for messing it up when if anything the only fault Gravity had was not changing to Renewal sooner. 

Blizzard changes things on the scale of Renewal with almost every expansion of WoW, and they have the biggest subscription game on the planet.  If you think for one second that Gravity didn't do the right thing by implementing Renewal, you're too set in the old way and can't see the tree for the forest.  As mentioned, not everybody is going to like Renewal, not everybody did.  But with the old players leaving, new players that like Renewal came, and the cycle continues.  We can all probably talk for days and armchair develop how we think Renewal should have happened, or how we want it to happen.  Hindsight is 20/20.

Triper

The only reason that I hate Renewal is just one - NPC Gears take you too far in the game doing solo runs and you don't need any card at all except if you do mvps :v

Gene

Once again that is my point, Gravity made the wrong move of making RO boring to play.

If you like to compare the changes that happend in RO and WoW, see how WoW is still fun to play every now and then unlike the changes in Renewal for RO.