What are the people opening new servers thinking?

Started by Lucanesti, Oct 31, 2008, 11:14 AM

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Descent

Quote from: Lucanesti on Oct 31, 2008, 02:33 PM
RMS is commonly referred to as the "Walmart" of RO servers. I believe this is true, its give more depth than just in/out voting sites.

Why not be able to rate the Karma of a server like we can with players without writing out a full review?

To people share the beliefs I do? Voting for rewards, donating for overpowered gears or access to "Donate Only" castles or whatever as just..bad? Why do people play on servers that support these things?

I've played a few servers like what you just described in my time. Usually friends, competition, etc are what keep me on a server. Actually, I greatly enjoy playing servers with OP donation gear, because there's no greater satisfaction than killing a donator in PVP and watching them freak out when they find out I hadn't donated a cent(and usually aren't wearing their broken donor gear to begin with). Are they bad servers? Usually. I'll gladly describe servers like that to my friends as "hellholes", and I usually stick around just to make some donators miserable. Then again, I'm not every player. :X

People have their reasons for sticking around...they don't have to necessarily like the server's configuration, but if their friends do, why ditch your friends, I guess? /hmm

Lucanesti

I understand that. Some people may find a few certain private servers that advertise outside the RO community and have misleading websites making it look like they own the game can bring players to a server who dont know their should be better options out there for them to play on make friendships and then once you've learned the game maybe you go play another server and find yourself alone. Friendship is big part of RO, sometimes the biggest.

Seeing you say you've played such servers, and would describe them as hellholes, would you support a karma system for servers? I think its a great idea to be able to give or take a karma point from a server perhaps without even registering (you would need proxy detection and IP logging to make sure it isnt abused) I think it would give a great inside view of a server before you even join.

Negative reviews I see can be challenged and sometimes too often removed.
http://www.jellopy.net/

For the REAL game experience =D

Descent

Quote from: Lucanesti on Oct 31, 2008, 05:06 PM
I understand that. Some people may find a few certain private servers that advertise outside the RO community and have misleading websites making it look like they own the game can bring players to a server who dont know their should be better options out there for them to play on make friendships and then once you've learned the game maybe you go play another server and find yourself alone. Friendship is big part of RO, sometimes the biggest.

Seeing you say you've played such servers, and would describe them as hellholes, would you support a karma system for servers? I think its a great idea to be able to give or take a karma point from a server perhaps without even registering (you would need proxy detection and IP logging to make sure it isnt abused) I think it would give a great inside view of a server before you even join.

Negative reviews I see can be challenged and sometimes too often removed.

It's a great idea, except that it can be abused by all the morons out there who will get a chip on their shoulders over being banned. Even with all the safeguards, the variable is the user.

Guest

Okay look here, Lucanesti you mentioned Pandora's server in your opening post, so she has a right to defend her self, and reply to it.

Also, RMS lists servers, and as long as those servers follow the ToS there's no real reason to have anything against them.

Furthermore, Descent, Poison Wolf, and Lucanesti, you guys may want to consider rephrasing, and rethinking some of the things you say, because at this rate, it won't end well for you guys, but like all things, it simply depends on how you continue to act.

Finally, if you think you can all behave in a mature, respectable fashion I'll leave this topic open, if not, I'll be closing it, and warning several of you.

Joshy_1289

Quote from: Lucanesti on Oct 31, 2008, 03:03 PM
There is nothing wrong with receiving donations. But when you are selling stat gears for large amounts of money and are clearly just trying to get money..then I think something should be done.

To be quite honest, Its really no ones business what the Admin of a server sells or doesn't sell. Just because you do not like spending money on Heavily Stated gear and I do doesn't mean it should be removed.

Some people look for servers that sell over powered gear. Some people look for servers that sell use able items. Some people look for servers with no donates at all...

To me, the people who complain about servers selling items, donates, have had bad experiences because they figured they were exempt from the rules. They were either banned or punished for actions.



Lucanesti

#20
I'll say and suggest whatever I wish. I am not being offensive and me and other members are engaging in conversation over the subject this forum is for. IS this not general discussion over the subject of Ragnarok Online? Now what I originally posted was interpreted incorrectly, or atleast I didnt mean it as an ATTACK on the server. They value a clean main, thats understandable and I never said a server shouldnt do that. I never called anyone a name about it. I did not engage in any personal attacks, spam or flameing. I tried to discuss the subject at hand I meant to discuss, when Pandora posted I said I understand the situation; I flipped out on Bloody ok I know, my account is locked and that is fine, its over. When you had out a punishment on an undesireable action is that not to give that person the ability to admit guilt and accept the punishment and then its over? I never brought up the personalities of what happened. I never aimed for drama, or the drama of the other members between themselfs. I asked for this topic to be locked if it couldnt be used for useful discussion..

The detail in which I went to in describing my time at heRO was given because it was the server closest what I desire in a server, and it didnt work well with me because of the time the server has been up and events being aimed at veteran players. I have every right to say I felt cold to the server, and did not fit in with the people there. New servers that are like heRO die every day because so many unprofessional LRs being launched every week and sputtering out like a bottle rocket. heRO is a well established and respected server, I would tell you that any time of the day. The people who fit in there fit well, some obviously stick out.

J J J you may say whatever you wish, I've tried to do nothing wrong. If you're going to be bias because of who Pandora is and threaten me, then well I see no way to respect any action that gives that perception.

To the matter I meant to discuss, rather than this petty drama..

I dont believe it is anyones right to launch a server in the name of profit. If someone wants to take a DONATION which would be giving money without reward or without reward of value is perfectly fine. I understand this costs money. What it boils down to is this. How is it still a "Donation" when you are rewarding them with valueable items? This is selling. You are selling others copyrighted IP to people. I think people need some more cuth about this issue. If its all about money then I say you have no right running a server. This is not a way to start a "company" by selling items. Its not your right to do so.

If people wish to buy their power, then go play on where the people selling it have the right, an offical server.
http://www.jellopy.net/

For the REAL game experience =D

Guest

I'm not being bias because I know Pandora, I'm acting, and stating my opinion, based on what has already happened in this topic, which was, you posting something that in turn created a reply with harsh tone and subject line. That is how I base my judgment in this case, you haven't posted before so I wouldn't be able to take that into account, thus, I based my statement on what I observed in this topic. Honestly I couldn't careless who replied, be it Pandora, heRO, Karei, Eternity RO, or CanadianCow, Euph RO, I based my statement on the actions taken, and the reactions due to those actions. In addition, I did not threaten you, I warned you, I don't believe in simply letting someone's behavior slowly build up until a point where I will have to take action, if I feel that your behavior will possibly lead up to that, I will warn you in advance,




as for the topic at hand, people create servers simply because everyone wants a "new" server, so, in turn that "new" server will attract more people at the start, but will only be short lived X.x
as for the money, most people in this world are motivated by greed, sooooo make a new server, get lots of money, and profits then just gets bored and lets everything play out without any real care in the matter anymore since they have what they came for

RO it self was a good game, its slowly being poisoned by the faults of humans, ironic kinda.... XD
money seems to mean everything now a days....

Scars

#22
JJJ is not being bias, as I said previously as well, you have the right to mention heRO, and Pandora have the right to defend it, as what JJJ exactly said as well. Both side has said more then necessary, but the argument has/should ended, and we best leave it as it is.

Regarding donation, yes you have your opinion, but then again what Joshy said:

QuoteTo be quite honest, Its really no ones business what the Admin of a server sells or doesn't sell. Just because you do not like spending money on Heavily Stated gear and I do doesn't mean it should be removed.

Some people look for servers that sell over powered gear. Some people look for servers that sell use able items. Some people look for servers with no donates at all...

To me, the people who complain about servers selling items, donates, have had bad experiences because they figured they were exempt from the rules. They were either banned or punished for actions.

That statement is fair really, if you dislike heavy donation server that is fair too, but its not fair for you to say that all those server with heavy donation should close down or is "bad", or for you to insult them. Really, donation or buy items in game, is out there in both official or private server mmorpgs, especially in non Pay to play games, you can't avoid it, and it is quite clearly the majority weather you like it or not.

Descent

In regards to donations, also, keep this in mind:

Most people that attempt to run one on a "dedicated" host are paying a very high amount of server fees, some of them could easily near $1,000 USD. How are they going to pay that out of pocket each month?

Unless of course, if they saved up a very high amount from the start, but that's unlikely.

THIS is why donations are a necessity on most servers. And the reason WHY they have the broken, high-stat donation gear is because they need an incentive to donate, even if it breaks the gameplay wide open and causes a rift between donator and non-donator.

Though it may seem like they're doing it for a profit(and most are...remember Debbie from AnimaRO? I heard that when he was alive the server made an EXORBITANT amount of money for him), most of them aren't. It's either they offer the broken donation gear that jaded, cheap players nowadays look for, or they offer the balanced gear, get little to no donations at all, and close up shop.

Becomes a harsh reality of supply and demand.

Lucanesti

I say that it is NOT donating when you are receiving items that gives you an advantage over others. You are buying, and the server is selling. Calling it a donation and using paypal is just trying to play it off as something different.
http://www.jellopy.net/

For the REAL game experience =D

Descent

Quote from: Lucanesti on Nov 01, 2008, 05:01 PM
I say that it is NOT donating when you are receiving items that gives you an advantage over others. You are buying, and the server is selling. Calling it a donation and using paypal is just trying to play it off as something different.

Mere technicalities.

When you donate to the Salvation Army guy at Christmas, do you not get a red poppy pin? You do.

Regardless of what you get in the end, it's a donation. Nobody goes to the malls around the holidays and says "Man, I can't wait to see that guy from the Salv, I want to wear one of those poppies".

Everybody has their own opinion of what a "donation" is, most of it isn't right, most of it is totally wrong, but in the end, everybody agrees to disagree and can leave it at that.

I am offering items for donations on my upcoming LR, consumables and whatnot. Does my server not have a right to be listed because of it?

Lucanesti

When you are giving something of worth, and receiving something of worth, you are purchasing.

Non-Traded Items that don't give you an advantage, an edge in the competition really is not something of value. You understand you're loosing value in the form of donation.


Donations are gifts given without return consideration. This lack of return consideration means that, in common law, an agreement to make a donation is an "imperfect contract void for want of consideration."
http://www.jellopy.net/

For the REAL game experience =D

Descent

Quote from: Lucanesti on Nov 01, 2008, 11:56 PM
When you are giving something of worth, and receiving something of worth, you are purchasing.

Non-Traded Items that don't give you an advantage, an edge in the competition really is not something of value. You understand you're loosing value in the form of donation.


Donations are gifts given without return consideration. This lack of return consideration means that, in common law, an agreement to make a donation is an "imperfect contract void for want of consideration."

No offense, but you and a few others are reading WAYYYYYYYYY too far into this donation thing.

Loki

People opened new servers because they wanted to help the RO community find a better server(theirs). But not having the patience, they just ban anyone who's giving a honest opinion.

Well I think they just screwed it IMO.

(No offense to those who's starting a server.)
QuoteWhatever floats your boat.

Scars