_____RO has full power GTB card! fools! RAGE RAGE RAGE

[Thoth]

GTB card makes some classes and builds unplayable! it kills servers! dispell resistance is ok, but why even pretend to have wizards if theres a card that makes you immune to magic damage? RAGE RAGE RAGE

______RO server has GTB card AND IT SUCKS!

[yugioh2211]

but you can use aoe skills like Storm Gust of Lord of Vermillion 

[Latin]

Because using that card in pvp/woe environment pretty much makes you receive 30% more damage from every  classes except wizard, prof, and magic ninja.

So yeah, IT SUCKS.

[Thoth]

Because using that card in pvp/woe environment pretty much makes you receive 30% more damage from every  classes except wizard, prof, and magic ninja.

you're right. we need a card that makes you take 0 damage from biochemists/whitesmiths. and another that makes you take 0 damage from champions/priests. there should be one for each class!

but you can use aoe skills like Storm Gust of Lord of Vermillion 

my 3-eyes grayish dragoon casts lord of vermillion! Slot your last pathetic card so I can end this, Yugi!
My grandfather's storage has no pathetic cards, Kaiba. But it does contain... the unstoppable Golden Thief Bug!
Golden Thief Bug? It-it's not possible! No one's ever been able to find it!

welcome to YuGiRO!

[Hermos]

Are you playing in said ____RO? Because if you are, I can show you how to kill people using GTB with a high wizard.

[Thoth]

Are you playing in said ____RO? Because if you are, I can show you how to kill people using GTB with a high wizard.

hah! I already knows how to stop tank classes wearing GTB! it goes something like this!

[Hermos]

hah! I already knows how to stop tank classes wearing GTB! it goes something like this!

Hahahahahaha 

[KeithXFormerX7]

Then full strip them, hopefully they don't have FCP -.-, or RAPE them with strong melee attack classes, till death, I bet that kRO might nerf it,50% dmg reduced from high wizard,40% from professors, -100% magic def from ninjas!!!!!! XD!!!!!!!!! Or 10% defense from majic ninjas, I hope it will be -200% magic def and get 400% dmg from prof, HW and ninjas XD!!!!!, ps, I don't even like prof,HW and ninjas(except Sasuke) XD

[KeithXFormerX7]

Forgot to tell, if I had GTB, I orefer to wear it only for PVM to give u guys a chance who likes magic players, if magic evasion from GTB, instead of 30% more dmg from physical classes, it should be 100%more dmg from physical classes

[Judgement]

PvP is broken even without gtb cards and other mvp cards in 1v1 situations
pvm is a joke
gtb wont make you god in WoE if it's in any server with a decent meta

I think FBH card is more OP, and I guess GR

[Kensei]

Good ol' days.

You guys remind me how people QQs on MvP cards without even thinking of counterplay.

[RoseTea]

I largely just don't agree with the idea that you get to completely no-sell classes entirely because you happened to win the MvP Drop dice roll.  Artificial scarcity is annoying enough, but making the most scarce objects among the most powerful is only sensible if you're making a terrible TGC.

It's not powerful in an interesting way.

[Thoth]

gtb wont make you god in WoE if it's in any server with a decent meta

you are absolutely right! the servers with half decent meta disable GTB card in woe!

[Judgement]

you are absolutely right! the servers with half decent meta disable GTB card in woe!

;Da

But really though I don't see how it can be used that effectively seeing how it takes shield slot which means you lose 35% range reduction, which is a big deal now that Snipers have become a strong DPS (dunno how much faster would 1 vit classes drop with it from bios).  But then again I haven't even WoE'd in those type of servers so wouldn't really know (immunity to dispell is cool).

Though I would agree balance through scarcity is dumb and doesn't work.

[yC]

This section is for server rant, I don't see a server being rant here so I'll move this to the RO board.

Yes, I agree why isn't there a card that give immune to physical and ranged non-magic attack on all elements.  Basically the opposite of GTB that will make the wearer only killable by magic attack.

[Fruit Pie~]

There's no card that gives immunity to physical ranged attacks because that would nerf Creators, and we can't have that.

Well, also because you can theoretically Pneuma/Safety Wall your way out of physicals, but that's like saying you can hide out of a 149 DEX Asura : it's possible, but under normal circumstances it's not happening.

But really though I don't see how it can be used that effectively seeing how it takes shield slot which means you lose 35% range reduction, which is a big deal now that Snipers have become a strong DPS (dunno how much faster would 1 vit classes drop with it from bios).

Snipers doing damage? Lowering to 1 VIT to help against Creators? Goddamn HORN CARD!?

Have you perchance written any RateMyServer guides?

[Judgement]

Just following the theoretical builds people use in WoE servers.  Like I said though haven't been in any guild so not really sure what builds they use, but from what I could gather around I have rough ideas.  Seriously though from the sound of your post you don't seem to know much about the current meta?  Snipers seem to have become a strong AoE DPS class along with other random random stuff.  The 1vit was refering to 1 base vit builds which has been common since 2010 or whenever those SM drops came in, though I've heard of 0 vit builds for AD immunity (obviously stun proof too).

Immunity to physical attacks is more broken than GTB because LP would cover the more effective magical skills (Quag/MS).Being able to only be killed by a few magic attacks is beyond OP. lol  Maybe if it's something like melee only.

[Fruit Pie~]

No no, I know the meta is to toss as many Creators at a problem as you can. Trying to metagame that with 1 VIT and Horn is like trying to end a roach infestation with mustard gas : it technically works, but you leave yourself open to a variety of other problems. You will also get cancer and die in the process. This isn't a good metaphor.

Sharpshooting doesn't really do any appreciable damage. I've seen it do roughly 600 damage in WoE, which is laughable compared to AD's 10k (and AD is hilariously faster). The one situation in which Sharpshooting is better is when there's enough Snipers to beat potion healing, you stack your whole damn 72-man guild on the same square and you forget to use Pneuma (or you stacked like that over LP). And if the planets align and this really happens, you deserve what you get.

[Thoth]

a horde of sharpshooting snipers sounds absolutely stunning 

[Judgement]

[Sunlive] WoE xRO BEASTMODE 10.03.2013

2013 RO, where AHK NDL etc is a requirement in woe guilds

also no more 76 player guilds, RO is dead 

[RoseTea]

also no more 76 player guilds, RO is dead 

If you mean WoE is dead, I certainly won't mourn it.  Look at the video you just linked: it's two clusters of players very slowly, if ever, actually moving and just swatting at each other while they stay firmly on their land protector with paladins devoting everyone.  Even breaking their defense doesn't actually mean the huddle dies fast.

(Of course AHK and such are required for WoE.  This isn't exactly a new revelation, macros were essential as soon as WoE began to exist.)

[Hermos]

Eh, I think you guys just don't know the meta and/or never played in really competitive servers/guilds.

[Fruit Pie~]

Eh, I think you guys just don't know the meta and/or never played in really competitive servers/guilds.

This was an useful, helpful and interesting reply.

(it wasn't)

So, uh, mind enlightening us on how WoE isn't just a Creator-fest other than the apparent lack of game knowledge past 2008 on your server of choice?

EDIT : God damn that xRO video. I, too, can do impossible area of effect DPS with a single Sniper when I'm using every last third-party software to make my animation frames go back in time. It's like saying you don't need wards in MOBAs because you can always maphack.

[Judgement]

Like it or not that's how the scene has turn to.  Though I don't doubt these guys could also play without using those 3rd party softwares, since the core of the GvG is proper stacking and roles.  And of course you start bashing us for playing TalonRO despite not knowing anything about the scene there.  It's true that it was played in a 08 style not too long ago but very recently the guilds have been playing more organized than that following the GvG format.

And how about your WoE experience?  Again, not sayin' I know everything, but I have an idea on how things work and have been watching the scene from the sides.  or trying

would post more but gtg :c

[Fruit Pie~]

And of course you start bashing us for playing TalonRO despite not knowing anything about the scene there.  It's true that it was played in a 08 style not too long ago but very recently the guilds have been playing more organized than that following the GvG format.

What do you mea-

Oh. Ohhh, lol. I genuinely didn't know you guys are from Talon! I make that 2008 comment about every server, don't worry too much about it (and I generally hit the mark because there's no such thing as a non-nostalgic RO player).

Don't take this as bashing you two for playing on TalonRO, I don't judge people based on the server they're from even if I don't like the server (I'm just straight up bashing you). It's just that I'm arrogant and come off as condescending when I don't mean to.

And how about your WoE experience?  Again, not sayin' I know everything, but I have an idea on how things work and have been watching the scene from the sides.  or trying

I'm really more experienced with oldschool WoE than normal WoE nowadays, but I've been in my fair share of competitive BR guilds. My WoE days are gone, but I try to keep in contact with the scene, or what little of the scene isn't playing Dota 2.

Like it or not that's how the scene has turn to.

I know and I can't change it, but I can at least laugh at it.

You also have to admit the Sniper wouldn't be NEARLY as good without 3rd party software, no matter how good at "stacking" and "roles" those guys are.

[Thoth]

  marijuana is going legal, why shouldn't AHK?

[Judgement]

oh lol that's alright.

Well from our experience in tRO it seems like snipers might actually be viable with enough snipers/buffs on it.  And since the WoE servers give out stat items like easy it's not too hard to have high ATK with stun resist and high ASPD apparently.

But yeah, 3rd party software just breaks the game to a whole other level.


..So bout' dat GTB card!

[Thoth]

But yeah, 3rd party software just breaks the game to a whole other level.

breaks? it fixed my carpal tunnel. RO without ahk breaks my hands~
if I have to either break RO or my hands, I know which one I will choose!

[Fruit Pie~]

AHK isn't so bad for the same reason I think Openkore is alright. All it does is automate stuff you can already do.

Actual cheating software is pretty bad, though.

EDIT : The REAL hilarity comes from the fact the same players who cheat are (usually) very much anti-bot, because botting is "unfair" and "breaks the game". There's no irony like iROny!

[Roda Frog of Sakray]

AHK isn't so bad for the same reason I think Openkore is alright. All it does is automate stuff you can already do.

Actual cheating software is pretty bad, though.

EDIT : The REAL hilarity comes from the fact the same players who cheat are (usually) very much anti-bot, because botting is "unfair" and "breaks the game". There's no irony like iROny!

I'm anti-both tbh.....But only if the server your playing on is more than just you, in which case it's like playing a single player game and whatever you do in a single player game is your own business : X. (like with sRO now....a friend and I hopped on during WoE to find we were literally the only ones on, so my friend hacked the game and gave himself GM powers, spawned a bunch of fantasy impossible items that didn't even exist on the server, '+10 Brynhild anyone?' and cloned us with our Hax dream builds so we actually had something to fight....then reset our builds after and discarded the items....which I'm totally fine with because it was practically a single player game at that point and it would have been boring otherwise.)

Edit: highlight of that WoE is the SS below where I took an alt assassin and had it cloned and the AI version of myself hit me with SB, stunning me and killing me as a result....LOL!

Edit: accidentally hit quote...if a mod could merge this with the previous post I would be happy : X

[edit by Triper: you can now be happy ;o]

[Thoth]

AHK isn't so bad for the same reason I think Openkore is alright. All it does is automate stuff you can already do.

abuse your players with grind enough, and they'll bot just so they can play on your server. getting the players to do all the work, gravity sure has a winning strategy! if you have any doubt it wasn't planned all along, just look at the fact iRO doesn't have packet encryption!

thank goodness gravity supports software botting. I don't want to buy an OpenKore keyboard...

[doctorfeelgood]

WoE and pvp, like many things, on iRO is completely broken. they dont disable mvp cards in pvp/woe because warp portal is mentally retarded so you have 70% of people in pvp with GTB and purple maya cards now that think theyre amazing pvpers when in reality theyre just s*** with really good gear. it pisses me off to no end that they would allow things to fall to such a pathetic state that even private servers are managing to have better WoE. i honestly dont know why these players stick around for years and years putting up with this s*** and feeding money into a broken game.

i dont even bother participating anymore because its so boring and unbalanced. GTB should never be active on any server in a pvp setting. /rant

[orewasugoi]

I think I should address two stupid comments made here. The official servers are against hitting but the American staff lacks a "Good" programmer to come up with a solution. Just look at how jRO has configured their login to see how a good bot prevention system works. They are able to take measures because they have the resources and programmers capable of creating a system like that. 

I often hear in response to this "why not be like a pserver and use (insert bot protection program)". Well my response is you still have bot problems. Yours are just smaller scale. Keep in mind the bit problems official servers face stem from zeny sellers more so than players.  American pservers do not have this problem because the true population is so low. There would be no profit in it for a zeny seller to start botting your (insert insignificant pserver name here).

Now for the GTB card. This card is good and has several great applications in both PvP and PvM. In WoE however it is such a double edged sword. Sure I'm immune to magic but now all physical damage skills hurt 30% more. Also you're not immune to sight or any of the detect skills while wearing. If you have a GR the combo becomes better but it's still one person who has that combo out of a guild that is surrounding them. It's easily beatable and yet I hear people cry about this all the time on pservers. Get over the GTB complex and enjoy the game how it was made to be played. For all you pservers enlightened s ought to stick with the base mechanics and gear in the game I applaud you.

[Bue]

Bot prevention in Japan is easier since they enforce IP blocking and restrictions on registration, which basically means that foreign operations will need to invest more capital in securing resources to deploy, which would discourage a majority of the guys-in-the-business. In the mean time, standard bot prevention will reduce the number of regular players from downloading and running there own bots. Ultimately, this comes down to handling national and industrial level operations, which cannot be avoided and probably few in numbers; meaning it is at least manageable and comes down to detection. Unlike Japan, official servers in NA are open to more potential threats and high returns, which means more bots. Ultimately, it comes down to whether or not it is worth it to investing in a losing war.

Also, keep in mind that the GTB card discussion changes context on servers with different configurations. In the end, allowing one-card to negate such a huge portion of the game is not a solution.

Food for thought:
On athena-base servers, there are item script bonuses for negating physical, magical, and misc damge:

Code Select Expand

bonus bNoMiscDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from misc attacks.",p;
bonus bNoWeaponDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from physical attacks.",p;
bonus bNoMagicDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from magical attacks. Grant character protection from magical spells.",p;
How would you feel if physical and misc damage can be avoid much like a GTB card can avoid magical damage? Note: these item script bonuses exist, but are currently not used by any item, except the GTB.

GTB's Item Script

Code Select Expand

{ bonus bNoMagicDamage,100; bonus bUseSPrate,100; },{},{}

[RoseTea]

On athena-base servers, there are item script bonuses for negating physical, magical, and misc damge:[/font]

What sort of things would be considered "misc" damage?

[Bue]

All other damage that is not classify as physical or magical, which I assume would be things such as traps.

[Triper]

@orewasugoi: You forgot that jRO has freedom to do whatever they want with RO while iRO have to ask always to kRO devs if they can do/apply changes ;s They may be bad but they're also limited on what they can do even if all they see is $$.

@RoseTea/Bue: AD!! It's considered Misc/Ranged/Neutral. And isn't FA misc too?

[Daletos]

What sort of things would be considered "misc" damage?

Damage that is not reduced or fixed? Maybe even status type and so on. Say Pressure, Gravitation field which always do the same amount of damage and the former pretty much ignores everything.

[Triper]

iCurious so here is what I got from doing a ctrl+f. Everything in here is considered misc skills but ofc some don't even give dmg ;s

Spoiler

Skid Trap
Land Mine
Ankle Snare
Shockwave Trap
Sandman
Flasher
Blast Mine
Claymore Trap
Remove Trap
Talkie Box
Falconry Mastery
Steel Crow
Blitz Beat
Detect
Spring Trap
Stone Fling
Suicide bombing
Suicide
Smoking
Dark Breath
Lullaby
Mental Sensing
Down Tempo
Battle Theme
Harmonic Lick
Classical Pluck
Power Chord
Acoustic Rhythm
Ragnarok
Unchained Serenade
Unbarring Octave
Perfect Tablature
Impressive Riff
Magic Strings
Song of Lutie
Hip Shaker
Dazzler
Focus Ballet
Slow Grace
Lady Luck
Gypsy's Kiss
Run
Gloria Domini
Battle Chant
Hallucination Walk
Falcon Assault
Sheltering Bliss
Running
Union of the Sun Moon and Stars
Gravitation Field
Wand of Hermode
Tarot Card of Fate
Acid Demonstration
Flip the Coin
Fling
Throw Zeny
Pang Voice
Wink of Charm
Electric Shocker
Cluster Bomb
Magenta Trap
Cobalt Trap
Maize Trap
Verdure Trap
Firing Trap
Icebound Trap
Self Destruction
Man Hole
Deep Sleep Lullaby
Speed
Bio Explosion

[close]

[Tsudere]

Errr ..

...
..
.

...Are I am the only who wonder about this topic? I played my Clown on 1 vit with gr/ed switch on a 255 server and in woe I had my devo.

Rest of equiment:

-garment: jakk/dustiness proxy

-accessoir: alligator/smokie

-shoes: HP Cards (costum or simply something like green ferus) tidals

-headgear: beret or headgear with mutlislots (when multislot -> giant hornet/leib olmain card/maya p/kiel if no link)

-armor: sniping suit or sloted fire armor oder sloted water armor (if kraken is ingame) for 3rd switch (trust me when I say that nobody is using water elemental hits in 2013 expect waterball, storm gust and rarely light spear of ice)

If bg set is available i would prefer it. If the enemies (never seen) using a gypsie go to 100 vit. If state imune is far above simply use stun immune gear (Stala, Flame Skull, Holy Marcher/Dark Bash - depending on your available headgear slots).

I fought with this build with a pala, an assa, a hw, a prof (mb) and a champ against groups above 15 ppl and after 20 fight I still had 0 deaths.
But for sure you can stack this setup up to 70 players per guild.
GTB is a great card, but wearing it means 30% dmg against demi human or 35% against range. Eating SBK or Sharp Shoot often means your death.

[orewasugoi]

Also, keep in mind that the GTB card discussion changes context on servers with different configurations. In the end, allowing one-card to negate such a huge portion of the game is not a solution.

Food for thought:
On athena-base servers, there are item script bonuses for negating physical, magical, and misc damge:

Code Select Expand

bonus bNoMiscDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from misc attacks.",p;
bonus bNoWeaponDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from physical attacks.",p;
bonus bNoMagicDamage,2,0,"0~Reduce %s%% of all damage taken from magical attacks. Grant character protection from magical spells.",p;
How would you feel if physical and misc damage can be avoid much like a GTB card can avoid magical damage? Note: these item script bonuses exist, but are currently not used by any item, except the GTB.

GTB's Item Script

Code Select Expand

{ bonus bNoMagicDamage,100; bonus bUseSPrate,100; },{},{}

Well lets discuss this card. I assume you would be referring to another shield based card. Now if it reduced 100% neutral the card wouldn't be over powered as it would only negate two major damage moves in woe. It would be very strong in PvM however and since unlike its similar counterpart the dr it would have no elemental strike drawback. This card would already boarder overpowered.

If it reduced all elemental physical damage it would be too strong which is unlike the GTB. Why? Well as I mentioned the GTB turns 2 casting classes into useless damage chars against them. This card would flip the field and allow you to turn 7-9 physical classes into useless chars. Also with the card you can stack up 60-80% magic reduction (all elements) which against even your strongest magic casters would make you almost unkillable. In PvM this would be so broken as just about any class would become a mental str champ.

This is why there is not a counter card. The physical card would be much much much stronger and all the other gear required to make that combo good is very easy to obtain. Whereas the GTB gr combo requires two very rare cards and is not nearly as strong.  Disagree with my assessments please tell me why.

[shishi]

Never heard of Magic Crasher skill?
I saw a wiz pawning gtb users with Magnum break (couldnt go near him) and Magic crasher.
If you use GTB and you're a shield user, you lose Thara, if you aren't a shield user and use GTB, you cut away your strength.
Is not an imbalanced card, is part of the thousand Ragnarok strategies.

[Bue]

Disagree with my assessments please tell me why.

1. Servers with different configurations changes the context of the GTB card.
2. Spell-casters do not have any counter against GTB card holders.
3. Players may change equipment.

You don't really need to think hard about this one.